- February 11, 2013 at 6:57 AM#7121gennyParticipant
In another thread, fromtheotherside, speaking of the materials presented againt the wmscog, said "none of your evidences speak for itself. if you have such evidence present it without your explanation."
I presented several 'evidences without explanation' there, but I think it would be a good idea to take each one separately into its own thread. Here's the second one:
Regarding the feasts that are to be kept in the 7th month: Several years the WMSCOG kept them in the 8th month. This is a fact established by the calendar and the record of feast dates.
I originally did not link to my research about it, because fromtheotherside did not want explanation, but if you'd like to see the research, I've collected it here:
There was no discussion about this point on the previous thread, but it's definitely open for discussion here.
- December 19, 2018 at 4:54 PM #74518
If this method of calculation is true, it can be applied to the “prophetic” Day of Atonement, October 22, 1844.
The first full moon after the autumn equinox is September 26th. This is Tabernacles 1844. Tabernacles is the 15th day of the seventh month, while the Day of Atonement is the tenth. Counting backwards 5 days from the 26th gives us September 21st, 1844 for the Day of Atonement. This inconsistency is caused by the fact that the Oct. 22 date is from the Saturday Adventists, not the WMSCOG. This means there is nothing prophetic about this date and AHS is a false prophet.December 19, 2018 at 6:30 PM #74520
GOD. THE. MOTHER. SAYS. MAYOR. AND. MIKE. LOVE. N. HONEY. MOUNTAIN. MOM. AND. BRIAN. TAYLOR. WILL. ALL. DIE. HORRIBLE. DEATHSDecember 19, 2018 at 6:31 PM #74521
GOD. THE. MOTHER. SAYS. ALL. YOU. MAYOR. AND. MIKE. LOVE. N HONEY. BRAIN. TAYLOR. WILL. ALL. DIE. HORRIBLE. DEATHSDecember 19, 2018 at 6:34 PM #74522
GOD. THE MOTHER. SAYS. DONT. WORRY. ABOUT. MY. FEASTS. YOUR. NOT. INVITED
GOD. HATES. ALL. OF. YOU. U. BETTER. COMIT. SUICIDE. BEFORE. HE. SENDS. KILLERS. TO. FIND. YOU. AND. POLICE. CANT. SAVE. YOU. THIS. TIME. MOUNTAIN. MOM. U. HILL. BILLY. CUNT. SNITCH.December 19, 2018 at 6:37 PM #74523
YOU WERE WRONG. TO. WISH. DEATH. ON. GOD. THE. MOTHER. NONE. OF. YOU. ON. THIS. WEBSITE. WILL. EVER. SEE. HEAVEN
YOU. WILL. DIE. HERE. ON. EARTH. YOU. BRIAN. TAYLOR. WILL. BE. EATEN. BY. DOGS. FOR. WHAT. YOU. SAID. ABOUT. GOD. THE. MOTHER. YOU. SPINELESS. COWARD. GO. KILL. YOURSELFDecember 20, 2018 at 4:33 PM #74533
UPDATE: My apologizes, but my previous conclusion was incorrect. While it was a close approximation, I have found the real answer, which also explains why 2010 tabernacles was the second full moon. Here’s a quote from first century Jewish philosopher Philo:
“And the sun, the ruler of the day, making two equinoxes every year, both in spring and autumn. The spring equinox in the constellation of Aries, and the autumnal one in Libra, gives the most evident demonstration possible of the divine dignity of the number seven. For each of the equinoxes takes place in the seventh month, at which time men are expressly commanded by law to celebrate the greatest and most popular and comprehensive festivals; since it is owing to both these seasons, that all the fruits of the earth are engendered and brought to perfection; the fruit of corn, and all other things which are sown, being owing to the vernal equinox; and that of the vine, and of all the other plants which bear hard berries, of which there are great numbers, to the autumnal one.” (Philo, On the Creation, 116, http://www.earlyjewishwritings.com/text/philo/book1.html)
The WMSCOG uses the pagan constellations to determine which full moon the feasts are on.
As far as the application to October 22, 1844, it remains the same since the first full moon after the autumn equinox is the full moon of Libra.December 20, 2018 at 5:58 PM #74534
GOD THE MOTHER SAYS. CHARCOAL. WILL. DIE. YOU. ARE. NOT. INVITED. TO. MY. FEASTSDecember 20, 2018 at 5:59 PM #74535
CHARCOA 1 WILL. DIE.December 20, 2018 at 6:01 PM #74537
YOU WILL NEVER GO TO A MOTHER GOD. FEAST. BASTAARDDecember 22, 2018 at 8:13 PM #74541
Just some further information that could be of help:
“But to the seventh day of the week he has assigned the greatest festivals, those of the longest duration, at the periods of the equinox both vernal and autumnal in each year; appointing two festivals for these two epochs, each lasting seven days; the one which takes place in the spring being for the perfection of what is being sown, and the one which falls in autumn being a feast of thanksgiving for the bringing home of all the fruits which the trees have produced.” (Philo, Decalogue, 161, http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/yonge/book26.html)
“In the month of Xanthicus, which is by us called Nisan, and is the beginning of our year, on the fourteenth day of the lunar month, when the sun is in Aries…” (Josephus, Antiquities Book 3, 10:5, http://sacred-texts.com/jud/josephus/ant-3.htm)
“And this is not an opinion of our own; but it was known to the Jews of old, even before Christ, and was carefully observed by them. This may be learned from what is said by Philo, Josephus, and Musæus; and not only by them, but also by those yet more ancient, the two Agathobuli, surnamed ‘Masters,’ and the famous Aristobulus, who was chosen among the seventy interpreters of the sacred and divine Hebrew Scriptures by Ptolemy Philadelphus and his father, and who also dedicated his exegetical books on the law of Moses to the same kings. These writers, explaining questions in regard to the Exodus, say that all alike should sacrifice the passover offerings after the vernal equinox, in the middle of the first month. But this occurs while the sun is passing through the first segment of the solar, or as some of them have styled it, the zodiacal circle. Aristobulus adds that it is necessary for the feast of the passover, that not only the sun should pass through the equinoctial segment, but the moon also. For as there are two equinoctial segments, the vernal and the autumnal, directly opposite each other, and as the day of the passover was appointed on the fourteenth of the month, beginning with the evening, the moon will hold a position diametrically opposite the sun, as may be seen in full moons; and the sun will be in the segment of the vernal equinox, and of necessity the moon in that of the autumnal.” (Eusebius, Church History Book 7 Chapter 32 16-18, http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/250107.htm)
The WMSCOG uses this calculation for Unleavened Bread and Tabernacles (both lasting seven days) and centers the other feasts around them.
1. After the spring equinox
2. When the sun is in the constellation Aries
3. When the moon is in the constellation Libra
1. After the autumn equinox
2. When the sun is in the constellation Libra
3. When the moon is in the constellation Aries
The use of the equinox in Second Temple (or Talmudic) Judaism was based on the late definition of the Hebrew word תקופה (tekufah) to mean equinox, when it actually means circuit or cycle (of a year). For more info, please read https://www.karaite-korner.org/abib_and_tekufah.shtml, which is from a Karaite Jewish scholar, that uses the Abib barely and sightings of the new moon to determine the dates, which is biblical.
The use of the constellations by the WMSCOG is as sure as possible without a direct confirmation from them, which I hope we get soon. I will post more info as I find it.December 22, 2018 at 8:14 PM #74542
PS: I’m not dead 😉December 22, 2018 at 9:46 PM #74543
IMPORTANT UPDATE: I have not found how the WMSCOG calculates the dates, but instead found how AHNSAHNHONG HIMSELF did. This is a blog that was linked on the NCPCOG homepage: https://blog.naver.com/PostList.nhn?blogId=acj01&categoryNo=13&from=postList
However, I cannot read Korean. If you or someone you know can, please help translate this.December 22, 2018 at 10:28 PM #74544
I just realized the blog is owned by Ahn Kwang Sup, which is Ahn Sahn Hong’s son, which gives the blog more credibility.December 23, 2018 at 1:20 AM #74545
Nice work, Charcoa1! That pattern does seem to match what’s going on.
Unfortunately for the wmscog, if this is how they make their calculation, then they are going against the Bible, as it would have been even when the ancient writers mentioned it. The Bible says to count the feasts according to the months, not according to the equinoxes. Lunar months do not always line up with the equinox perfectly. If God had meant them to count by the equinox, He would have said so.
As it is, they are like Jeroboam in 1 Kings 12:31-33
“… On the fifteenth day of the eighth month, a month of his own choosing, he offered sacrifices on the altar he had built at Bethel…”December 26, 2018 at 11:27 AM #74547
I’ve found pictures of most of the WMSCOG calendars:
January 7, 2019 at 8:46 PM #74548
I’ve realized all but 1997 are visible, so here are the links to the image sources:
1993 & Passover 2000 https://blog.naver.com/ceongkim/10187554782
I couldn’t find 2018 (the NCPCOG did have one, but it seems to have been made by them and not the WMSCOG).March 12, 2019 at 3:12 PM #74608April 5, 2019 at 12:36 AM #74646
Has anyone heard the website Jews for Jesus?November 29, 2019 at 1:54 PM #74829
About a year ago, I discovered that the WMSCOG bases Passover on the full moon after the spring equinox, and the Feast of Tabernacles on the full moon after the autumn equinox. Since they have finally publicly posted their fall feasts dates for 2019, I just wanted to give an update to show that this is still the case.
Moon Phase calendar: https://eclipse.gsfc.nasa.gov/SKYCAL/SKYCAL.html
Spring Feasts: http://usa.watv.org/news/content.asp?idx=53250&page=2&menu=I
Fall Feasts: http://usa.watv.org/news/content.asp?idx=54133&page=1&menu=I
Because a full moon coincided with the spring equinox, Passover was on the next full moon, April 18th. Tabernacles showed no deviation as well, being on October 13th, which was a full moon.
They are sometimes 1-2 days off, but I believe there is no doubt that this is the measure they use for the calendar, and it is unbiblical. From this, I predict that 2021 Passover will be on March 28th, and 2021 Tabernacles will be on October 20th, making this another year where there are 8 months between the two feasts, not 7 (for more information, please see https://www.examiningthewmscog.com/archives/the-feast-dates/). I highly encourage this to be brought to members of the WMSCOG so they can try to answer why this is done. Also, be sure to come back here after 2021 to see if my prediction is accurate.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.