[Moved-Comment]

This comment was originally posted on "The WMSCOG's Failed Predictions of 1988, 1999, and 2012.  What Will They Predict Next?" on 11/28/12 in reply to Jeff.

Really?? says:

What truth ??? I guess anyone can write anything on the internet about anybody and everyone believes.

1)  Does everyone know that this website is being paid to slander the WMSCOG?  

sound like they like money 🙂

2)  Guess who paying this website ? I hope is not another church ? oh my no    way!!! , I thought they would do this because they love God

3)  And really please think about Jesus clearly talk about the end many times ?

    And even Paul talked about the end ? the whole bible talks about it ?

4)  is it not a little presumptuous to use a Facebook snap shot that says 2012  and write a  whole page about it ?LOL

But really God told us that he can come anything time ,2000000,3000000 and now. It is in Matthew 24 if your wondering. Did he not say "be ready" ? Why are you going against the teaching of Christ ?  If The WMScog says "we should be ready " this site says" look their talking about the End" lol

Titus 1:15 – "To the pure, all thing a pure, but to those who are corrupted and do not believe , nothing is pure . They  claim to know God ,but by their actions they deny him " 

Watch this site say anyone can use that verse? 🙂 But anyway Christ said "be ready" so it can never be wrong to say that 🙂

[genny]

[genny]

That's right, Simon.  Facts are facts and can be verified elsewhere.

fromtheotherside wrote:

You guys us this no 'ad-hominem' but the fact of the matter is, if in fact admin recieves or recieved compensation for his efforts on this site then credibility would become an issue.  Because most likely his source for which he got most of his so called -evidence-  would be the same source who compensates him.  So is this a an issue I do believe so. So untill he can prove credibility, everything on this site is circumstantial. You guys have burden of proof.

You are making an accusation based on pure speculation.  See how you start with the word "if" as in "IF in fact admin receives…"?  You are making the accusation, so the burden of proof is on you to provide even a little evidence that would support your claim.

I've noticed that others on this forum speculate about the WMSCOG, but they either have some evidence that would lead to such speculation, or they admit that it's speculation.

And please remember that "facts are facts."  Even if you disagree with opinions and interpretations, the facts are not 'circumstantial.'

I'm glad you are here to share your thoughts.  Obviously there is information on this website that you diagree with.  Can you please specify any factual information that you think is incorrect on this website?  This is your chance to get those errors put right, if you have found any.

[fromtheotherside]

Any evidence can be used to back up anyside, depending on how it's used and who's presenting it.  In this case the evidence is used to backup the claims made by this website and by whoever is funding it.  And none of your evidences speak for itself.  if you have such evidence present it without your explanation.  Also admin and his invovlment with the wrong people still is left unsettled.

[genny]

fromtheotherside wrote:

Any evidence can be used to back up anyside, depending on how it's used and who's presenting it.  In this case the evidence is used to backup the claims made by this website and by whoever is funding it.  And none of your evidences speak for itself.  if you have such evidence present it without your explanation. 

Ok, evidence without expanation?  Start with these:

1.  Regarding the teaching of the Catholic Church being the Antichrist: the Ostrogoths were not destroyed in 538, the '10 kingdoms' from the Roman empire were not as the WMSCOG presents, 5 were destroyed not 3, and the destruction or survival of these 'kingdoms' did not depend on their following the Catholic Church.  These are historical, textbook facts.

2.  Regarding the feasts that are to be kept in the 7th month: Several years the WMSCOG kept them in the 8th month.  This is a fact established by the calendar and the record of feast dates.

3.  Regarding the teaching that Isaac was God.  Isaac lies in Genesis 26.  God does not lie (Titus 1:2).

Also admin and his invovlment with the wrong people still is left unsettled.

There is nothing to settle until you show any evidence that there is "involvement with the wrong people.'  You need something more than speculation.

[Elievalkyrie]

 

fromtheotherside wrote:

Oh really, bunch of hypocrites. (you gonna erase this to admin??^^ I notice you guys are the ones who delete comments, information control i c, wait do I smell…. CULT?)   Your whole site is filled with accusations but no proof.  Stop filling peoples thoughts with lies and deceit. You guys hold hands with liars and people who only want monetary gain.  So you admin are being paid to do this.  Prove you are not! Or we will take it you are.

O it's none of our business huh? It is when you are hurting our family and friends and loved ones!  Spreading hatred and lies.  Promoting prejudice amongst God loving people.  It is our business.  And we won't stop until you are revealed for who you really are. 

Money makes you lie doesn't it? 

You are given proof in the main page, you just don't believe it because you got it in your head that it is all lies. Before the Admin can try to prove that he is not being paid, you must first also prove to us that he IS being payed. Can you provide check accounts? Recorded statements that he was receiving money for this site?

 

You are already hurting your loved ones without any help from us.

[Elievalkyrie]

fromtheotherside wrote:

Any evidence can be used to back up anyside, depending on how it's used and who's presenting it.  In this case the evidence is used to backup the claims made by this website and by whoever is funding it.  And none of your evidences speak for itself.  if you have such evidence present it without your explanation.  Also admin and his invovlment with the wrong people still is left unsettled.

While the admin provided lots and lots of evidence,  you on the other hand has not given a single one of it. Care to supply us with your evidence now?

[Joshua]

fromtheotherside, boy you guys seem despirate! Things not working out so well for your group? I gladly back the winning side! On our side we have the one who is testified about in the Bible. The same one that your own created god Ahn testified about being the only way to salvation. We have Jesus the Christ! History does not support your position, the Bible does not support your position, your own teachings contradict themselves, and your own created god taught against you! You are in a losing position and that is a fact. What do you present? Nothing so far! No proof, no facts, and it appears no reality. Start backing up your claims now! By the way, many of us would be willing to support this website financially in order to bring the truth that we have here to you. 

[fromtheotherside]

Lolz, Winning side? Let's see there are how many of us 1,234,566 7 digits strong, now how many of you?  12…..LOLZ !   You have Jesus?   What kind of blasphemy is that? You profane His name saying you follow God's will.  That same Christ who you think you follow speaks against you, calling you evil doers, you don't follow his laws you don't know who Jesus Christ is, all you have is a false belief.  You have no idea about Ahnsahnghong and what taught.  Your the one who lost reality, your in your own world, filled with 10 people, you guys are manipulated by people you don't even know about and you hold hands with them being used as pawns!  You don't know the bible, You don't believe in Jesus Christ and You don't know God! Prove you do!

[fromtheotherside]

Joshua I read your comments it looks better for your group if you stay out it.^^

[fromtheotherside]

In regards to Genny's question 1. I don't have any idea what you're talking about, the kingdom was overthrown in 538, the ostrogoth people as a people and some risistance was left even after and they had small squirmishes here and there but in 538 their kingdom was conquered-overthrown, samething!

 The Ostrogoths. Ridpath dates the establishment of the Ostrogothic nation

in 493,and its overthrow in 538, and its total destruction in 554. The

following is from Ridpath's History of the World, Vol. IV, pp. 408-417:

"Bishop Wulfila, or Ulfilas, labored for forty years among the Goths, and

saw as the fruits of his labors the conversion of the entire people to the

Arian branch of Christianity….The Ostrogoths had grown to be first in

influence among the barbarian states….In religious faith Theodoric, like

his people, was an Arian. This fact opened a chasm between the Goths and

the Italians, the latter accepting the Nicene creed….Certain it is that

Justinian, who had now succeeded to power at Constantinople, resolved to

purge the church of heresy as well in the West as in his paternal domin-

ions." The agent of the emperor in the extermination of heresy was Belisar-

ius who had destroyed the Vandal nation.

The Nation Destroyed. "Nearly the whole Gothic nation gathered around the

Eternal City; but Belisarius held out until reenforcements arrived from the

East, and after a siege of a year and nine days' duration, Rome was deliv-

ered from the clutch of her assailants. Vitiges (the Ostrogothic leader)

was obliged to burn his tents and retreat (538) before his pursuing antag-

onist to Ravena….It was evident that the kingdom of the Goths was in the

hour and article of death." Speaking of the final defeat of the Goths in

[538?] Ridpath says that there was "inflicted on the barbarians a defeat so

decisive as to refix the status of Italy. The greater part of the Gothic

army perished either by the sword or in attempting to cross the river…As

for the Goths, they either retired to their native seats beyond the moun-

tains or were absorbed by the Italians."–Id. In chapter 41 of Gibbon's

Roman Empire is a graphic description of the campaigns of Belisarius

against the Vandals and Ostrogoths resulting in their defeat and overthrow.

Thus the three Arian nations who refused to renounce their heretical faith

were uprooted or subdued and the other Arian peoples turned orthodox leav-

ing the bishop of Rome the undisputed ruler of nations and the corrector

of heretics. How completely the prophecy was fulfilled .

 

[Simon]

if you were right mother would be ashamed of your treatment I believe you heard of the ninth commandment. and maybe mothers teaching number nine since you believe in her

[Elievalkyrie]

fromtheotherside wrote:

In regards to Genny's question 1. I don't have any idea what you're talking about, the kingdom was overthrown in 538, the ostrogoth people as a people and some risistance was left even after and they had small squirmishes here and there but in 538 their kingdom was conquered-overthrown, samething!

 The Ostrogoths. Ridpath dates the establishment of the Ostrogothic nation

in 493,and its overthrow in 538, and its total destruction in 554. The

following is from Ridpath's History of the World, Vol. IV, pp. 408-417:

"Bishop Wulfila, or Ulfilas, labored for forty years among the Goths, and

saw as the fruits of his labors the conversion of the entire people to the

Arian branch of Christianity….The Ostrogoths had grown to be first in

influence among the barbarian states….In religious faith Theodoric, like

his people, was an Arian. This fact opened a chasm between the Goths and

the Italians, the latter accepting the Nicene creed….Certain it is that

Justinian, who had now succeeded to power at Constantinople, resolved to

purge the church of heresy as well in the West as in his paternal domin-

ions." The agent of the emperor in the extermination of heresy was Belisar-

ius who had destroyed the Vandal nation.

The Nation Destroyed. "Nearly the whole Gothic nation gathered around the

Eternal City; but Belisarius held out until reenforcements arrived from the

East, and after a siege of a year and nine days' duration, Rome was deliv-

ered from the clutch of her assailants. Vitiges (the Ostrogothic leader)

was obliged to burn his tents and retreat (538) before his pursuing antag-

onist to Ravena….It was evident that the kingdom of the Goths was in the

hour and article of death." Speaking of the final defeat of the Goths in

[538?] Ridpath says that there was "inflicted on the barbarians a defeat so

decisive as to refix the status of Italy. The greater part of the Gothic

army perished either by the sword or in attempting to cross the river…As

for the Goths, they either retired to their native seats beyond the moun-

tains or were absorbed by the Italians."–Id. In chapter 41 of Gibbon's

Roman Empire is a graphic description of the campaigns of Belisarius

against the Vandals and Ostrogoths resulting in their defeat and overthrow.

Thus the three Arian nations who refused to renounce their heretical faith

were uprooted or subdued and the other Arian peoples turned orthodox leav-

ing the bishop of Rome the undisputed ruler of nations and the corrector

of heretics. How completely the prophecy was fulfilled .

 

As I have understand from wmscog's teachings, it was the "Little Horn", which they claim as the Papacy to uproot or destroy the three nations, which are the: Vandals, Ostrogoths and Heruli, is this correct? But this source stated that it was Belisarius who was the one to destroy the Ostrogoths under the command of Emperor Justinian who wanted to conquer back the Roman Empire. 

Also, it was stated in this website (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heruli#Independent_Kingdom_and_later_years) that the Heruli was destroyed by the Lombards (another tribe), the Papacy was not mentioned.

[genny]

fromtheotherside wrote:

In regards to Genny's question 1. I don't have any idea what you're talking about, the kingdom was overthrown in 538, the ostrogoth people as a people and some risistance was left even after and they had small squirmishes here and there but in 538 their kingdom was conquered-overthrown, samething!

 The Ostrogoths. Ridpath dates the establishment of the Ostrogothic nation

in 493,and its overthrow in 538, and its total destruction in 554. The

following is from Ridpath's History of the World, Vol. IV, pp. 408-417:

"Bishop Wulfila, or Ulfilas, labored for forty years among the Goths, and

saw as the fruits of his labors the conversion of the entire people to the

Arian branch of Christianity….The Ostrogoths had grown to be first in

influence among the barbarian states….In religious faith Theodoric, like

his people, was an Arian. This fact opened a chasm between the Goths and

the Italians, the latter accepting the Nicene creed….Certain it is that

Justinian, who had now succeeded to power at Constantinople, resolved to

purge the church of heresy as well in the West as in his paternal domin-

ions." The agent of the emperor in the extermination of heresy was Belisar-

ius who had destroyed the Vandal nation.

The Nation Destroyed. "Nearly the whole Gothic nation gathered around the

Eternal City; but Belisarius held out until reenforcements arrived from the

East, and after a siege of a year and nine days' duration, Rome was deliv-

ered from the clutch of her assailants. Vitiges (the Ostrogothic leader)

was obliged to burn his tents and retreat (538) before his pursuing antag-

onist to Ravena….It was evident that the kingdom of the Goths was in the

hour and article of death." Speaking of the final defeat of the Goths in

[538?] Ridpath says that there was "inflicted on the barbarians a defeat so

decisive as to refix the status of Italy. The greater part of the Gothic

army perished either by the sword or in attempting to cross the river…As

for the Goths, they either retired to their native seats beyond the moun-

tains or were absorbed by the Italians."–Id. In chapter 41 of Gibbon's

Roman Empire is a graphic description of the campaigns of Belisarius

against the Vandals and Ostrogoths resulting in their defeat and overthrow.

Thus the three Arian nations who refused to renounce their heretical faith

were uprooted or subdued and the other Arian peoples turned orthodox leav-

ing the bishop of Rome the undisputed ruler of nations and the corrector

of heretics. How completely the prophecy was fulfilled .

 

Since you trust Ridpath, I will use that book also.  To read about the end of the Ostrogothic kingdom, you would start at the bottom of page 413 when Belisarius enters Italy.

Now see where you quoted this: "Vitiges (the Ostrogothic leader)

was obliged to burn his tents and retreat (538) before his pursuing antag-

onist to Ravena….It was evident that the kingdom of the Goths was in the

hour and article of death."

The first part of that quote is on page 414 and it is in 538, but the second part (after the "…" ) is on page 417 and it is in the year 553.  That's what I would call clever quoting, making it sound like your whole quote is about the year 538, when it is not.

Your other quote says: "Speaking of the final defeat of the Goths in

[538?] Ridpath says that there was "inflicted on the barbarians a defeat so

decisive as to refix the status of Italy. The greater part of the Gothic

army perished either by the sword or in attempting to cross the river…As

for the Goths, they either retired to their native seats beyond the moun-

tains or were absorbed by the Italians.""

Your insert of "[538?]" before the quote shows that you either don't have the actual book to refer to, or you are deliberately trying to make us think this was in 538.  Here's what the full sentence in the book (page 417) says:

"Here, in 554, the petty eunuch inflicted on the barbarians a defeat so decisive as to refix the status of Italy."

And then in the next paragraph, "Thus, in the year 554, after a period of sixty years' duration, was subverted the Ostrogothic throne of Italy."

You see, in 538, Belisrius almost destroyed the Ostrogoths, but not quite.  They regrouped and fought back, and they fought so hard that it it took until 554 to finally defeat them.  It was not some "small resistance" and "skirmishes here and there."

When the WMSCOG talks dates for the defeat of the Heruli and the Vandals, they use the dates given in history books for the end of those wars.  But not so with the Ostrogoths.  They use a different date to fit their purposes, but it is not an accurate date.

I haven't talked yet about your point regarding Arianism.  But I think I've said enough for right now.

Here's another piece of evidence without explanation:

4. Regarding the President's Call to Service Awards that the WMSCOG displays: The award level shown for "World Mission Society Church of God" is not available for groups, only individuals.  And the awards shown for "Kim Joo-cheol" and "Zahng Gil-jah" are only available to United States citizens.

[Joshua]

fromtheotherside wrote:

Lolz, Winning side? Let's see there are how many of us 1,234,566 7 digits strong, now how many of you?  12…..LOLZ !   You have Jesus?   What kind of blasphemy is that? You profane His name saying you follow God's will.  That same Christ who you think you follow speaks against you, calling you evil doers, you don't follow his laws you don't know who Jesus Christ is, all you have is a false belief.  You have no idea about Ahnsahnghong and what taught.  Your the one who lost reality, your in your own world, filled with 10 people, you guys are manipulated by people you don't even know about and you hold hands with them being used as pawns!  You don't know the bible, You don't believe in Jesus Christ and You don't know God! Prove you do!

 Prove that I do? There are post all over this website that prove I do. It's in black and white. Despiration on your part even throwing something like this in here.

[Joshua]

fromtheotherside wrote:

Joshua I read your comments it looks better for your group if you stay out it.^^

 Even more despiration. Man you guys are looking bad. I am really looking forward to you bringing something real to this forum. If you think that you are the first person to come here and call us names and make false statements with no backup I afraid that you are more delutional than I thought. Some of my friends here have provided PROOF that your groups teachings are wrong. Here's something for you: You claim that you are less than 1,300,000 strong. (I doubt you even have that many.) Your group claimed a year and a half ago to have 1,400,000 members and is growing. Liar comes to mind. We are to be above comtempt and you sir have already proved that you are not! Suggestion: Calm down, bring your questions, stop making pathetic aquisations, and back up your claims with something that can be verified. As it seems right now you fit into many of the experts prerecs for a typical cult member. Stop being a typical cult member and start showing us that you are not just throwing mud and that you actually have something of value to share with us.

[genny]

fromtheotherside wrote:

In chapter 41 of Gibbon's

Roman Empire is a graphic description of the campaigns of Belisarius

against the Vandals and Ostrogoths resulting in their defeat and overthrow.

Thus the three Arian nations who refused to renounce their heretical faith

were uprooted or subdued and the other Arian peoples turned orthodox leav-

ing the bishop of Rome the undisputed ruler of nations and the corrector

of heretics. How completely the prophecy was fulfilled .

Hi fromtheotherside.  I'm back to address the other portion of your point, about Arianism.  When you say, "the three Arian nations who refused to renounce their heretical faith were uprooted or subdued and the other Arian peoples turned orthodox leaving the bishop of Rome the undisputed ruler of nations and the corrector of heretics."

You imply that the Catholic Church destroyed those three kingdoms because they were heretics, and that they did not destroy any of the other kingdoms because they agreed with the Catholic Church or converted quickly (soon after 538) to aviod being conquered.  Here's what you should know about the other 7 kingdoms on the WMCSOG's list:

Visigoths–transitioned from Arianism to Catholicism between 577-584.  Conquered in 711 when they were Catholic.

Anglo-Saxons–Pagan until the 7th century.  Not conquered until 1066.

Franks–became Catholic in 496, not conquered.

Alemanni–became Christian in the 7th century. Conquered in 496 by the Franks, but not counted as one of the conquered kingdoms by the WMSCOG.

Burgundians–transitioning to Catholicism when they were conquered by the Catholic Franks in 534.  Also not counted as a conquered kingdom by the WMSCOG.

Lombards–did not even enter the Roman Empire's territory until the 540s, and kingdom not established there until 572.  Mixed in religion, but did not become mostly Catholic until the late 7th century.

Suevi–converted to Catholicism in the 560s but became part of the Visigoths in 585.

The only ones that fit the WMSCOG model are the Franks and maybe the Suevi.  The other 5 don't fit.  They were either conquered but not counted as conquered (since the WMSCOG only wants to count 3), or not conquered even though they remained "heretics," or conquered even though they were Catholic, or not even in the right place at the right time.

[Sarah2013]

Fromtheotherside, what you fail to realise here is that most, if not all, on this site barely know each other; yet we have distinctly similar stories. My point isn't to argue with you here but to state facts. Yo either know your church is false or you are clearly being deceived. That woman and man you call god cannot be god for so many reasons. In spite of the broken record "God bless you" heard all the time, the inner eyes revealed something different. There is no real love in your church. Doesn't she speak of ways to love in her book? which had to be practiced during Sabbath breaks? Yet, aside from the food you get, of which the groups pays for ( as it was for our group), what exactly is your mother doing? Please don't tell me protecting her children. Half the members aren't really happy. I was one of them just like a few who have left. And many more will leave eventually. You can only fool people to a point where they catch on. From my understanding there is only one angle holding back the wind, so by now he ought to have let go. Your teaching is that this your mother god is the reason why the world hasn't ended. Listen sir/madam, no amount of robotic teaching you bring here can prove your church is real. As for this site, it is more absolute than all your churches in the world put together. The truth hurts and is very bitter, so get used to it. To be honest, for all the damage your Organization has caused a lot of families and friends they ought to be sued to the fullest. You have no idea how many former members exist out there. This is not a joke. People who barely know each other saying the same thing about this wmscog??????? No "brother/sister" you either know you church is a fake or you are clearly being deceived. Your organization has so desecrated the Bible – what a mess your organization has made. And to think it is still bending and twisting minds is pure mind control tactic. I have never seen a church which spent a great deal of time trying to condemn another church. Wmscog is just too greedy.

[fromtheotherside]

Joshua wrote:

fromtheotherside wrote:

Joshua I read your comments it looks better for your group if you stay out it.^^

 Even more despiration. Man you guys are looking bad. I am really looking forward to you bringing something real to this forum. If you think that you are the first person to come here and call us names and make false statements with no backup I afraid that you are more delutional than I thought. Some of my friends here have provided PROOF that your groups teachings are wrong. Here's something for you: You claim that you are less than 1,300,000 strong. (I doubt you even have that many.) Your group claimed a year and a half ago to have 1,400,000 members and is growing. Liar comes to mind. We are to be above comtempt and you sir have already proved that you are not! Suggestion: Calm down, bring your questions, stop making pathetic aquisations, and back up your claims with something that can be verified. As it seems right now you fit into many of the experts prerecs for a typical cult member. Stop being a typical cult member and start showing us that you are not just throwing mud and that you actually have something of value to share with us.

Bring something real? So you're acknowledging there was nothing real here to begin with?^^

You claim that you are less than 1,300,000 strong. (I doubt you even have that many.) Your group claimed a year and a half ago to have 1,400,000 members and is growing. Liar comes to mind. 

So where's your proof? I thought you brought proof before making an arugment? Does hypocrate come to mind. lolz.  

Oh cult member.. lolz never had any questions for your buddy, because I already know your answers! Hey grow up Joshua and stop letting your emotions take you over.  If you have any arguments try acting like an adult and state your argument without looking childish.

[fromtheotherside]

For sarah I posted about your comment in the other forum.  Everyone being happy does not prove your the right religion, people's thoughts are different from God's and most christians want to believe that what makes them happy is God's will, again then how about the apostles who left because they loved the world.  Or Ananias and Sapphira they were just trying to help themselves.  unfortunatly our will or what makes us happy is not God's will.  Are all people happy at your church or any church I doubt it.  It's the same.  And Go look at the other post in the other forum, I think it's I believe in Mother or something.  Anyhow just because you had a bad experience does not prove if a church is real or not if that is your way of evaluating a church or a religion then they are all fake.  

[Sarah2013]

This is a more serious issue than you know. There is a difference between rubbing people of true beliefs, deception and not being happy in a church. My unhappiness was its mental poison and lies. I am certain wmscog, is not the first “church” so to say, that you have been too. The heavy prosecution is not because it is “true God” as they claim but because it leans more toward deception. How can God of the universe, notice I have said God of the universe, come out of that which he condemns – idol worship. Please don’t quote scriptures to me because your organization has made a mess out of the living word of God. My experiences is way deeper than you know. He is either God or He isn’t God. If the teacher had a solid unquestionable background then one can understand but in this case it doesn’t. Look at your church or church???? There is so much secrecy…. You can’t do this, you can’t do that…. You can’t be friends with members outside of church (and trust me, this is fact). No…. This organization is a lie and their is no truth in it. The time is coming very soon when it will all come out in the open. The creator of this universe will prevail as always. Mind control is its (wmscog) tactic…. How many disabled people do you have in your current church? What about those who are indigent? How many of them exist? Is Your god only interested in students? For the most part? This is not even the type of battle to engage in especially when deep down inside you know most people here are very close to the truth.

[genny]

fromtheotherside wrote:

If you have any arguments try acting like an adult and state your argument without looking childish.

I stated mine already.  Do you have any response?