- Topic
Greetings;
As part of a group of families affected by the WMSCOG in Puerto Rico I feel a responsibility to warn people (including the Hispanic) about how negative is this cult. In Puerto Rico we are facing different situations with our loved ones since they were captured in the WMSCOG, among these are: physical abuse, school dropout, they hardly eat, inadequate rest, harassment from other members, loss of respect for their families, etc... all this from our loved ones that have totally changed since they entered the WMSCOG. By the leaders of the two "churches" that they have here on the island, we have been victims of: disrespect, lies, hypocrisy, challenges, have ignored any attempt to dialogue, etc … The WMSCOG may try to censor any evidence they find about people telling the truth about who they really are but until they stop breaking apart our family ties and teaching a doctrine that is completely false, there will always be people who will want to publish their experiences. I hope it's just a matter of time for them to realize how wrong they are.
We thank you infinitely for providing such excellent information, that has definitely been helpful to clarify our doubts and confirm all the suspicions we had about WMSCOG.
Do you know if there are lawsuits from families against the WMSCOG? Do any law protects us from their wrong behavior?
Saludos:
Como parte de un grupo de familias de Puerto Rico afectadas por la Iglesia de Dios Sociedad Misionera Mundial me siento con la responsabilidad de alertar a las personas incluyendo a las personas hispanas acerca de lo negativo que es esta secta. En Puerto Rico hoy dia enfrentamos diferentes casos desde que nuestros seres queridos fueron captados en la Iglesia de Dios Sociedad Misionera Mundial, entre estos se encuentran: Agresion fisica, desercion escolar, poca alimentacion, poco descanso, perdida de respeto hacia familiares, etc… todo esto de parte de nuestros seres queridos que han cambiado totalmentearte desde que entraron a la IDSMM. Por parte de los lideres de las dos "iglesias" que tienen aqui en la isla hemos sido victimas de: faltas de respeto, mentiras, hipocresia, retos, han ignorado todo intento de dialogo, etc… La IDSMM podra intentar censurar cualquier tipo de prueba que encuentre que diga la verdad de lo que son pero mientras se dediquen a romper lazos familiares y a ensenar una doctrina que es totalmente falsa, siempre existiran personas que desearan hacer publica sus experiencias. Espero que solo sea cuestion de tiempo para que se den cuenta de su error.
Les agradecemos infinitamente por brindarnos tan excelente informacion, definitivamente que nos ha sido de gran ayuda para aclarar nuestras dudas y corroborar todas las sospechas que teniamos acerca de la WMSCOG.
Que ustedes conozcan, existen casos legales de parte de familiares en contra de la Iglesia de Dios Sociedad Misionera Mundial? Existe alguna ley que nos proteja por su errado comportamiento?
nosectaspr wrote:
Greetings;
As part of a group of families affected by the WMSCOG in Puerto Rico I feel a responsibility to warn people (including the Hispanic) about how negative is this cult. In Puerto Rico we are facing different situations with our loved ones since they were captured in the WMSCOG, among these are: physical abuse, school dropout, they hardly eat, inadequate rest, harassment from other members, loss of respect for their families, etc... all this from our loved ones that have totally changed since they entered the WMSCOG. By the leaders of the two "churches" that they have here on the island, we have been victims of: disrespect, lies, hypocrisy, challenges, have ignored any attempt to dialogue, etc … The WMSCOG may try to censor any evidence they find about people telling the truth about who they really are but until they stop breaking apart our family ties and teaching a doctrine that is completely false, there will always be people who will want to publish their experiences. I hope it's just a matter of time for them to realize how wrong they are.
We thank you infinitely for providing such excellent information, that has definitely been helpful to clarify our doubts and confirm all the suspicions we had about WMSCOG.
Do you know if there are lawsuits from families against the WMSCOG? Do any law protects us from their wrong behavior?
You make the claim members of WMC hardly eat. I have to tell you this seems like you are unaware of what is happening in their lives. I can attest I have never eaten as well as since I have come to Zion. In fact if I don't want to eat they don't force me but they still make sure I have at least eaten before and encourage me that I must eat for my own strength (not that it needs to be there but at least to eat)
You also claim since joining WMC people aren't getting addequet sleep. Who get's adequet sleep these days anyways? seriously I have more sleep deprevation from School and Work than WMC. BTW I started School over two years after joining WMC with ENCOURAGEMENT from my deacon.
As for disrespect for their families maybe the fact you call them in a cult (and others things I experience from my family) makes them feel unrespected and they (while they should not) are just reflecting how they feel they are being treated back at you.
As far as "disrespect, lies, hypocrisy, challenges, have ignored any attempt to dialogue, etc" I receive all of that from nonWMC people all the time including family and Pastors and what not.
As far as laws protecting you from the allged wrong behaviour only two of those, if they are really occuring, would be illegal harrassment and physical abuse and of course you can, and if they are really occuring SHOULD, report those to proper authorities, even I do not believe WMC is above the law. So if you are being honest then really you should report things.
But we have to remember NOONE is perfect save God be it Ahnsahnghong and Zahnggiljah or just Jesus so everyone will mess up so I hope you have expressed your physical concerns with your family beyond just saying I think you are in a cult or something because I know I would be more open to those concerns than that statement.
OMG! Todo esto es cierto!!! Mi familia tambien ha sido afectada por esta gente. Quizas fuera de Puerto Rico existan casos diferentes pero si se que aqui en Puerto Rico todo lo que escribio nosectaspr es cierto. Mi madre lleva una lucha con mi hermana desde que entro aqui, dejo sus estudios universitarios y ahora lo que dice es que no quiere estudiar porque el fin del mundo llegara a finales del 2012 y esta perdiendo el tiempo, que al contrario, todo lo que ella debe hacer es predicar y estudiar la Biblia, incluso ella dice que quiere estar en Sion cuando Ahn Sahng Hong venga a buscar a los escogidos. Tambien entiendo lo de la pobre alimentacion… Les pongo el ejemplo que mejor conozco, el de mi hermana… Ella actualmente se levanta a las 3am, se va a su iglesia (a veces caminando mas de una hora para poder llegar alla), a esa hora no dan comida en "Sion", la traen de vuelta como a las 6:30 am, se acuesta a dormir aproximadamente como hasta las 9 am ya tiene que irse a predicar asi que anda de prisa y usualmente no le da tiempo de comer en mi casa porque las "hermanas la estan esperando", se van a la calle a predicar, a veces regresa antes de volver a irse para Sion, a veces predica y se va directamente a Sion. Mi madre ha sabido llamarla varias veces durante el dia para preguntarle si ha comido y ella misma le dice que no, mi madre le dice que al menos le diga donde se encuentra para ella llevarle algo de comer y mi hermana nunca le dice donde se encuentra, muchas veces llega a la casa hambrienta, otras veces le dice a mi madre que pudo comer algo como a las 10 pm que fue que los hermanos de "Sion" cocinaron, usualmente lo que comen es pasta con pollo, pero como sea, no se esta alimentando bien. No creo que las iglesias de Puerto Rico esten cocinando todo el tiempo, quizas debido a los pocos seguidores no cuentan con el dinero necesario para comprar tantos alimentos ya que muchos de los jovenes que estan ahi tampoco trabajan, mi hermana misma me ha confirmado acerca de varias personas que han dejado sus estudios y que hace tiempo estan buscando un empleo part time como ella por que no pueden estar tanto tiempo fuera de Sion. Dejo claro que si conozco de varias mentiras como por ejemplo: Una vez mi madre llamo a la lider de mi hermana para preguntarle si mi hermana estaba con ella ya que no podia contactarla a su celular y queria saber si habia comido algo, y la misma le contesto que no, que no sabia donde se encontraba mi hermana y que en definitiva no andaba con ella. Ese mismo dia, mi madresalio al centro comercial a cambiar algo que habia comprado y se da con la sorpresa de que mi hermana estaba predicando con esa misma lider con quien mi madre habia hablado poco antes de salir al centro comercial. Acerca de la hipocresia, los retos etc., entiendo muy bien lo que quieren decir. Aunque mi madre y yo no estamos de acuerdo con las creencias de la WMSCOG, nunca hemos atacado la religion como tal, a veces mi hermana me pide consejos, otras veces no me habla, pero mi madre siempre trato a esas personas con respeto, inclusive, cuando vinieron a presentarse y a hablar de lo bueno de aprender de la palabra de Dios mi madre les dijo que la religion es muy importante, al igual que los estudios y tener una vocacion, ellos reaccionaron como que estaban de acuerdo, para ese tiempo, ellos eran bienvenidos en mi hogar, sin embargo, una amiga de mi hermana una vez se encuentra a mi madre y en la conversacion le dice que era una lastima que mi hermana no estuviera asistiendo a clases ya que era ina excelente estudiante, luego mi madre se entera por otras amistades de mi hermana que la lider de su iglesia iba a la universidad a buscarla, o sea, mi hermana no estaba asistiendo a sus clases por irse con ella a predicar. Eventualmente corroboramos que la informacion era cierta. Frente a mi madre siempre eran saludos, sonrisas pero mi madre no sabia lo que le estaban haciendo a mi hermana ni lo fanaticos que son de esa religion. Hoy dia mi hermana ya no obedece a mi madre en nada, no ayuda ni coopera en la casa para nada, no estudia, no trabaja, no comparte con la familia etc. Simplemente comparto y apoyo lo que escribio nosectas y le agradezco por la informacion ya que no existe mucha informacion es espanol que nos hable acerca de casos reales como los nuestros.
Lamentablemente en PR la ley no nos da muchas opciones. No se le puede prohibir absolutamente nada ni cerrarles la puerta con seguro porque ya son mayores de 18 a~os y lamentablemente la ley de libertad de culto los cobija.
Here is a translation of the above post.
OMG! All this is true! My family has also been affected by these people. Perhaps out of Puerto Rico there are different cases but I do know that here in Puerto Rico all you wrote is true nosectaspr.My mother has a fight with my sister since she began attending, she quit college and now she says she does not want to study for the end of the world will come late in 2012 and is wasting her time, and instead, all that she should do is preach and study the Bible, even she says she wants to be in Zion when Ahnsahnghong comes for the elect. I also understand about the poor eating habits … I will give you the best example I know, that of my sister … She now gets up at 3am, going to his church (sometimes walking over an hour to get there), at that time they do not serve food in "Zion", they bring her back at about 6:30 am, she goes to bed around until about 9 am and must leave to preach usually in a rush and usually without having time to eat at home because the "sisters are waiting for her" to go to the streets to preach, sometimes returns before leaving to return to Zion, sometimes preaches and goes directly to Zion. My mother has been able to call several times during the day to ask if he has eaten and she says no, my mother says to at least tell her where to bring her something to eat and my sister never says where and often comes home hungry, sometimes she tells my mother she could eat something like at 10 pm which was when the brothers of "Zion" cooked, usually what they eat is pasta with chicken, but even still she is not eating well. I do not think that the churches in Puerto Rico are cooking all the time, perhaps because a few followers do not have the money to buy as much food as many of the young people who are not working there, my sister has confirmed herself about several people who have left school and are looking for a long time for a part time job like her because they cannot spend a lot of time out of Sion. Made clear, I know of several lies like: One time my mother my sister's leader to ask if my sister was with her because she was unable to reach her by calling her cell phone, and wanted to know if he had eaten something, and the leader answered no, that she did not know where my sister was and was not with her. That same day, my mother went out to the mall to exchange something that she had bought and to her surprise, she sees my sister preaching with the same leader with whom my mother had spoken to just before leaving to go to the mall. About hypocrisy, challenges,etc, I understand very well what they mean. Although my mother and I do not agree with the beliefs of the WMSCOG, we have never attacked religion as such, sometimes my sister asks me for advice, sometimes she doesn't speak to me, but my mother always treated those people with respect, including when they came to present and talk about the goodness of learning from the Word of God, my mother told them that religion is very important, as studies and have a learned skill or career, they reacted as though they were in agreement at the time, and they were welcome in my home. However, a friend of my sister's in a conversation with my mother, tells her that it is a shame that my sister is no longer attending classes because she was such an excellent student. Then my mother learns from other friends of my sister that the leader of his church was going to her college to pick my sister up, that is, my sister was not attending classes to go with her to preach. Eventually we confirmed that the information was true. In front of my mother there were always greetings, smiles but my mother did not know what they were doing to my sister and how fanatical that religion was.Today my sister does not obey my mother at all, does not help or cooperate in the house for anything, does not study, does not work, does not share with the family and so on. I just agree and support what nosectas wrote and thank you for the information because there is not much information in Spanish that talks about real cases like ours.
Unfortunately, in PR the law does not give us many options. You can not prohibit absolutely anything or lock the door because they are over 18 years old and unfortunately the law of religious freedom protects them.
Jubilee wrote:
Why does God loose lawsuits? Because this organization is not God! It's just an organization. Ahnsahnghong really has nothing to do with the way wmscog is orperating. He ASH founded the NCPCOG not the wmscog.
Actually in the long run WMC hasn't lost law suits upon appeals.
Ahnsahnghong Established BOTH they are the same church split apart over time neither of which have the original name.
As far as abuse while I doubt it is happening if it is or you suspect it is police/attorney should be consulted, even if you are wrong you are doing what you think is best. I assume PR doesn't punish you for good faith complaints…
nosectaspr wrote:
By the way, thanks Emily for that translation, very interesting story, I don't doubt anything that jess wrote.
De por cierto, gracias Emily por la traduccion, muy interesante historia, no dudo nada de lo que jess escribio.
I don't doubt it either. The story that Jess wrote sounds almost exactly like what at least 3 different families, whom I know personally, have suffered here in the mainland United States. It is very sad.
Yo tampoco lo dudo. La historia que Jess escribio suena casi exactamente como lo que sufrieron 3 familias diferentes, quienes yo conozco personalmente, aqui en los Estados Unidos. Es muy lamentable.
shimon wrote:
Ahnsahnghong Established BOTH they are the same church split apart over time neither of which have the original name.
the NCPCOG does not believe in a mother god and the WMSCOG does.
the NCPCOG has writings of Ahn that the WMSCOG does not.
ttr wrote:
shimon wrote:
Ahnsahnghong Established BOTH they are the same church split apart over time neither of which have the original name.
the NCPCOG does not believe in a mother god and the WMSCOG does.
the NCPCOG has writings of Ahn that the WMSCOG does not.
NCPCOG split from Father after he revealed mother in 1984
WMSCOG has all of Father's books and autographical notes and photographs of Father revealing Mother and all of Father's original disciples.
shimon wrote:
ttr wrote:
shimon wrote:
Ahnsahnghong Established BOTH they are the same church split apart over time neither of which have the original name.
the NCPCOG does not believe in a mother god and the WMSCOG does.
the NCPCOG has writings of Ahn that the WMSCOG does not.
NCPCOG split from Father after he revealed mother in 1984
WMSCOG has all of Father's books and autographical notes and photographs of Father revealing Mother and all of Father's original disciples.
again, please cite some evidence for your claims.
please quote a book from Ahn or the WMS which attests to what you are saying.
i can say Ahn didn't believe in a mother god, but I have his writings to back that claim up:
loocpoc wrote:
Iam sure "Father" wasnt in his right mind considering he died of a brain injury the next year.
Brain aneurisms do not cause you to not be in your right mind they are inert until they kill you.
ttr wrote:
shimon wrote:
ttr wrote:
shimon wrote:
Ahnsahnghong Established BOTH they are the same church split apart over time neither of which have the original name.
the NCPCOG does not believe in a mother god and the WMSCOG does.
the NCPCOG has writings of Ahn that the WMSCOG does not.
NCPCOG split from Father after he revealed mother in 1984
WMSCOG has all of Father's books and autographical notes and photographs of Father revealing Mother and all of Father's original disciples.
again, please cite some evidence for your claims.
please quote a book from Ahn or the WMS which attests to what you are saying.
i can say Ahn didn't believe in a mother god, but I have his writings to back that claim up:
ttr wrote:
shimon wrote:
ttr wrote:
shimon wrote:
Ahnsahnghong Established BOTH they are the same church split apart over time neither of which have the original name.
the NCPCOG does not believe in a mother god and the WMSCOG does.
the NCPCOG has writings of Ahn that the WMSCOG does not.
NCPCOG split from Father after he revealed mother in 1984
WMSCOG has all of Father's books and autographical notes and photographs of Father revealing Mother and all of Father's original disciples.
again, please cite some evidence for your claims.
please quote a book from Ahn or the WMS which attests to what you are saying.
i can say Ahn didn't believe in a mother god, but I have his writings to back that claim up:
so quote a book that says I have a book? That is the most asinine thing I have ever read,
shimon wrote:
so quote a book that says I have a book? That is the most asinine thing I have ever read,
re-read what i said, because that's not what i asked.
So, it's been awhile, what's up with out there in PR ?
Simon wrote:
nosectaspr wrote:
Greetings;
As part of a group of families affected by the WMSCOG in Puerto Rico I feel a responsibility to warn people (including the Hispanic) about how negative is this cult. In Puerto Rico we are facing different situations with our loved ones since they were captured in the WMSCOG, among these are: physical abuse, school dropout, they hardly eat, inadequate rest, harassment from other members, loss of respect for their families, etc... all this from our loved ones that have totally changed since they entered the WMSCOG. By the leaders of the two "churches" that they have here on the island, we have been victims of: disrespect, lies, hypocrisy, challenges, have ignored any attempt to dialogue, etc … The WMSCOG may try to censor any evidence they find about people telling the truth about who they really are but until they stop breaking apart our family ties and teaching a doctrine that is completely false, there will always be people who will want to publish their experiences. I hope it's just a matter of time for them to realize how wrong they are.
We thank you infinitely for providing such excellent information, that has definitely been helpful to clarify our doubts and confirm all the suspicions we had about WMSCOG.
Do you know if there are lawsuits from families against the WMSCOG? Do any law protects us from their wrong behavior?
You make the claim members of WMC hardly eat. I have to tell you this seems like you are unaware of what is happening in their lives. I can attest I have never eaten as well as since I have come to Zion. In fact if I don't want to eat they don't force me but they still make sure I have at least eaten before and encourage me that I must eat for my own strength (not that it needs to be there but at least to eat)
You also claim since joining WMC people aren't getting addequet sleep. Who get's adequet sleep these days anyways? seriously I have more sleep deprevation from School and Work than WMC. BTW I started School over two years after joining WMC with ENCOURAGEMENT from my deacon.
As for disrespect for their families maybe the fact you call them in a cult (and others things I experience from my family) makes them feel unrespected and they (while they should not) are just reflecting how they feel they are being treated back at you.
As far as "disrespect, lies, hypocrisy, challenges, have ignored any attempt to dialogue, etc" I receive all of that from nonWMC people all the time including family and Pastors and what not.
As far as laws protecting you from the allged wrong behaviour only two of those, if they are really occuring, would be illegal harrassment and physical abuse and of course you can, and if they are really occuring SHOULD, report those to proper authorities, even I do not believe WMC is above the law. So if you are being honest then really you should report things.
But we have to remember NOONE is perfect save God be it Ahnsahnghong and Zahnggiljah or just Jesus so everyone will mess up so I hope you have expressed your physical concerns with your family beyond just saying I think you are in a cult or something because I know I would be more open to those concerns than that statement.
Hi Simon. I think before saying that it didn't happen, you should analyze if it just didn't happen in your zion. I'm still in zion, and in my zion people have been told to drop of out school, people have become more disrespectful to their parents (me included) because we start seeing them as if they are not in zion they dont have much value. I don't say people are not disrespectul outside of zion, but in zion you lose all sympathy for other people that are not in the church. Even though some people dont get adequate sleep, but you don't know how old is the person that nosectaspr is describing, maybe is somebody young that before didn't go through all that. My point is, you shouldn't try to say that its not true because it didn't happen to you. In my zion for example, i've heard my pastor and deacons critizing other zions in the west coast for being weak. Not everybody in the catholic church has been molested, but the people that havent been molested shouldnt call the other ones that were molested liars just because it wasnt their experience. Just my humble opinion, hope you don't take it wrong.
outdated^
Two and half year ago, while I was in the Zion. every day we preach once I was paired with a student. He had married male contact so he took me to the location on our way I asked him few question. He was just 16 years, 1) I asked what do you do brother? He said nothing. 2) Do you study ? I was going to college but I left now. 3) Why did you left? oh my god he was so innocient, he told brother end is near why to study. 4) who told you
? my Aunt told me and I have heard. 5) Who is you Aunt? She is a Decon 6) Is your Aunt Educated? No my Aunt have never been to School/College. Then I told the brother you must continue you study your Aunt is Uneducated she is listening what zion says. but in bible it is written no one knows the time. you must be prepare for father but don't leave you study. this is true story happen to me if time comes I can let any body know who is he, who is his Aunt (Decon) and who am I too.
Love wrote:
Two and half year ago, while I was in the Zion. every day we preach once I was paired with a student. He had married male contact so he took me to the location on our way I asked him few question. He was just 16 years, 1) I asked what do you do brother? He said nothing. 2) Do you study ? I was going to college but I left now. 3) Why did you left? oh my god he was so innocient, he told brother end is near why to study. 4) who told you
? my Aunt told me and I have heard. 5) Who is you Aunt? She is a Decon 6) Is your Aunt Educated? No my Aunt have never been to School/College. Then I told the brother you must continue you study your Aunt is Uneducated she is listening what zion says. but in bible it is written no one knows the time. you must be prepare for father but don't leave you study. this is true story happen to me if time comes I can let any body know who is he, who is his Aunt (Decon) and who am I too.
Even I, The All Knowing, All Powerful, All Mighty, Ever Living Stained have a Heart; and this story has broken it. Honorary Stainey award here folks. No counsel required, this is by Executive Order. All Hail.
[STAINED SEAL OF APPROVAL] I will not forgive, I will not forget, I promise.
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