- Topic
There have been some contentious issues about whether or not Ron said some of the things he said.
Let us examine direct quotes from Ron, compare them to the statements of others, and compare them to what happened in reality.
According to Ron @ 11:29 "in the early days we didn't have any black members at all"
I know several black members that joined the truth before Ron, and some of them are even deacons or higher. This statement is objectively false. Lets see what other people think about it:
Truth says "Ron NEVER said there were NO Blacks in the church!"
Some people didn't actually pay attention to what Ron said, and they distort it. But good going Truth, your adament vote of confidence is partially correct, we did have black members.
Freedfromreseda says "I too know the names & ranks of the early black members in reseda. A couple of them are still there."
You heard it here first, folks, even non-believers admit that Ron was lying when he said "we didn't have any black members at all".
So what else did Ron say?
According to Ron @ 11:55 "And they said directly that canaan was cursed always which is why black people are cursed and they can never enter heaven"
The same "early day" black members spoken of @ 11:29 are the exact same ones who proclaimed not only their own salvation, but salvation to others. Our church has always offered salvation to all persons and has never descriminated against blacks. You who are in the WMSCOG know theese black members by name, and so does the forum member Freedfromreseda.
We can see clearly that Ron wasn't telling the truth about how we view black people, everyone is promised eternal life regardless of skin color! You know it, WMSCOG members, you know the black elders and the white elders; and their stories match.
So what else did Ron say?
According to Ron @ 12:16 "we were told actually pretty recently probably about two years before I left we were all taken into a room and we were asked not to preach to black members anymore"
Here we can see that black members were in fact actually preached to up until this time according to Ron, and we who know them know that they have always been promised eternal life.
But what about this decree of 2010 from the church not to preach to black members anymore? Did that really happen?
No, it did not. The church has always recruited black members, they continue to recruit black members, and nobody has ever said to stop preaching to black members. Ron was fibbing about what our church was told to do. We actually have a humongous black community, it is by no means a minority or treated like a minority, you know it and I know it.
Lets see what other people think of this:
Freedfromreseda says "maybe the only black deacon they have currently will get a promotion
Not only do we still preach to blacks, but even non-believers admit some of them even have titles, because we do not have any prejudice against them and we do not treat them differently than anyone else.
Questioninginla says "This is the issue whether or not Ron lied or forgot."
We can see over and over Ron is tripping over his own lies in addition to many more, but you WMSCOG members from the "early days", from 2005, and even now, all of you know that there was no "end of the world" statement given for 2012 and that some seriously unstable people are continuing to lie as they already have.
Lets see what other people think about Ron's message:
Truth says "Diane and Ron told the truth"
Sarah2013 says "Ron is not the liar here"
Emil says "Speaking of the claim that Ron is lying, I don't see what the problem is."
Uh oh, I think there are some people who would like to amend their statements here.
Reply below to discuss.
144000 wrote:
Sorry, but I know black members from before Ron.
We don't count the ones with a heavy layer of spray-on tan 🙂
These and the coal miners were just to start things off. But basically most koreans are disgusted by blacks… it's a cultural thing.
But now that they provide them with enough offerings, of course they are going to leave them~!
The way things are going they might even bring in some japanese fellas ^^
I was just trying to get your attention. You ignored my previous question. It wasn't rhetorical.
We'd love the show.Hopefully that first black member is not mulatto. By the way, they are good with cameras so all that needs to be done is review them and point out the black member.
144000 wrote:
Sarah2013
You really love making up assumptions about things you have absolutely no knowledge of don't you?
I was there for 2010, I was there before 2010, I visisted and was able to chit chat with some of those members from 2010. And I was there after 2010.
Not in my Zion, not in any of the zions I ever went to after that, and surely not from L.A. Zion did there ever, during any point in time, come any messages that blacks did not get eternal life, or that we should stop preaching to blacks.
Prior to 2005 there is the true testimony of black members who I know and we all know who do go back to practically the founding of the church, those black members were the early days.
But I'm sorry, I think I interrupted how you were saying your flagrant assumptions were "the truth"?
And when did you think I was there, last week? No. You have no real clue. You only know what I utter here. So don't be too sure what I know and don't know.
@144000 Since you personally know these older black members, kindly tell them that you are on this forum discussing this topic. Ask them to do a short video with you explaining all your so called facts. So far all I’ve noticed is that you want people to believe YOU just because you SAY you know these people and that it was never said, that the WMSCOG location that Ron attended never stated to stop preaching to blacks. Show & Prove! It’s that simple! Otherwise there is no point to continue a circular conversation. No one is digging a deeper whole you started this thread you should provide undisputed facts. Your “facts” you claim to have provided are disputable.
No need for me to backpedal…only you. I know what I know. I will not put words in Ron’s or anyone else’s mouth for that matter. You don’t know what was said to whom behind closed doors. You only know what was said to you & in front of you. Many things are discussed with certain members that may not be discussed with others ie. bible studies, rebuking, who is not tithing. The list goes on. So you don’t know what Ron was taught and you shouldn’t presume to know because you weren’t with Ron 24/7 if at all
Exactly.
Listening to all this back and forth argument from a complete outsider perspective, I find one thing odd. If the WMSCOG finds so much of lying in Ron's video, I am shocked they have not sued him or Steve Hassan. Given their propensity to sue on much smaller quantum of evidence, this is very surprising.
There is true information and disinformation. You create disinformation to control true information.
Wmscog’s teaching on Ahang is disinformation which is used to control true information – the scriptures in the bible. Same goes for Ron’s testimony.
@144000
I'm not arguing, I asked for you to provide proof which you haven't and then you choose to run from a thread you created. Saying you were only here to show people who know you and knew those older members is just a vague way of weasling your way out of something you couldn't prove. Again I pray for all of you, and pray more and more of Wmscog members keep coming here to learn. I really believe this site is wearing WMSCOG down because more and more people like 144000 keep coming here trying to protect this evil organization. That means your members are paying attention to all your lies!
Perhaps 144000 and Ron should have tea and discuss, in a comprehensive manner, all things WMSCOG?
Oh wait, Ron's the enemy. Is it really that easy? Answer: yes it is.
What would this have in common with [insert any controlling group here]?
144000, what does "the early days" mean to you? The early days of Ron's membership? The early days of the L.A. church? The early days after Ahn died? The early days of the church in the 1960s?
144000 wrote:
Even as the end gets closer, we are still congradulating new mothers and blessign thme and wishing them well and asking them to tell us how they are share fragrances, serve them, and treat them with family love.
Even as the end gets closer, we are still congradulating new mothers and blessign thme and wishing them well and asking them to tell us how they are share public confessions, serve them, and treat them with family love.
FIXED.
It always seems so empowering to individuals to share the great and wonderful stories of how "I used to be an alcoholic" "I used to use drugs" "I used to [insert worldly item here]", until it goes down the rabbit hole in which there is no other place at all to exist or my life will go down that slippery slope….
It's not empowering, its called a scenario in which the power is greatly to one's disadvantage.
jump in at 4:00 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VPtl2xR3Zzc
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