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This article was originally posted on WMSCOG vs Ji Won Tak – Court Case and has been moved here for further discussion:
Renita says:
The comments honestly sound like the people who crucified Jesus saying, "If you are God, then free yourself from our hands." However, Jesus didn’t do anything, yet, many people believe that He is God who even testified Himself to be God. It looks like He lost against humans 2,000 years ago. Who’s to say He won’t lose to humans again? Serious question: Do any of you believe Jesus is God? If so, why didn’t He do anything when He was being crucified?
an interesting point I found online too
Jesus offered Himself as the sacrifice for our sins. The animal sacrifices pointed to Him and when He died there was no more need for animal sacrifices.
“In the middle of the ‘seven’ He will put an end to sacrifice and offering.” Daniel 9:27 (NIV)
an interesting point I found online too
Jesus offered Himself as the sacrifice for our sins. The animal sacrifices pointed to Him and when He died there was no more need for animal sacrifices.
“In the middle of the ‘seven’ He will put an end to sacrifice and offering.” Daniel 9:27 (NIV)
Hmm.. I have my own idea as to what that means but I dare not say.
Hmm.. I have my own idea as to what that means but I dare not say.
I really do not know my point was there are too many possibilities as to why 3 versus 7.5
I really do not know my point was there are too many possibilities as to why 3 versus 7.5
shimon wrote:
I really do not know my point was there are too many possibilities as to why 3 versus 7.5
Can you share a couple of those possibilities? Are they scriptural or just guesses?
It seems I hear all the time, "the meaning is spiritual, not physical," "it's spiritual not physical," "You can't interpret that physically, it has a spiritual meaning," "Everything is copy and shadow," "It's copy and shadow"… And now "It doesn't mean anything special."
You know that if the Bible had recorded David's reign as being split 3 and 37, they'd be all over it–"Look how it matches, copy and shadow!"
Why is it that when 'copy and shadow' doesn't work with the wmscog in something that should considering their interpretative (is that a word?) tendencies, they ignore it?
shimon wrote:
I really do not know my point was there are too many possibilities as to why 3 versus 7.5
Can you share a couple of those possibilities? Are they scriptural or just guesses?
It seems I hear all the time, "the meaning is spiritual, not physical," "it's spiritual not physical," "You can't interpret that physically, it has a spiritual meaning," "Everything is copy and shadow," "It's copy and shadow"… And now "It doesn't mean anything special."
You know that if the Bible had recorded David's reign as being split 3 and 37, they'd be all over it–"Look how it matches, copy and shadow!"
Why is it that when 'copy and shadow' doesn't work with the wmscog in something that should considering their interpretative (is that a word?) tendencies, they ignore it?
Genny:
That's why I shared my thought about shadows. Sometimes the reality isn't what the shadow appeared to be. How can we know which shadows are which kind? Well, when it is explained to you how the 2 hands come together to make the bunny, you can see clearly the shadow/ reality & believe it. But how hard is it to explain something you don't fully know. You're telling me, "The shadow is a bunny. The reality must be a bunny." But I'm telling you, "The reality isn't a bunny at all. They're hands." How can I expect you to believe me? If that's the extent of what I can explain, how could you possibly understand?
There are so many areas in study where the shadow is 1 bunny & the reality are 2 hands. Many lamb sacrifices in the OT represent 1 human sacrifice in the NT. Christians collectively agree on this. You're telling me that 1 man's sacrifice equals over a million lambs, bulls, goats, & heifers sacrifices? Jesus is called the Lamb because He fulfilled the sacrifice of the lamb. Why not be called the Bull of God or the Heifer of God? Why is He referred to as the Lamb of God only? Some parts of prophecy are exact while others are not.
Genny:
That's why I shared my thought about shadows. Sometimes the reality isn't what the shadow appeared to be. How can we know which shadows are which kind? Well, when it is explained to you how the 2 hands come together to make the bunny, you can see clearly the shadow/ reality & believe it. But how hard is it to explain something you don't fully know. You're telling me, "The shadow is a bunny. The reality must be a bunny." But I'm telling you, "The reality isn't a bunny at all. They're hands." How can I expect you to believe me? If that's the extent of what I can explain, how could you possibly understand?
There are so many areas in study where the shadow is 1 bunny & the reality are 2 hands. Many lamb sacrifices in the OT represent 1 human sacrifice in the NT. Christians collectively agree on this. You're telling me that 1 man's sacrifice equals over a million lambs, bulls, goats, & heifers sacrifices? Jesus is called the Lamb because He fulfilled the sacrifice of the lamb. Why not be called the Bull of God or the Heifer of God? Why is He referred to as the Lamb of God only? Some parts of prophecy are exact while others are not.
genny wrote:
shimon wrote:
I really do not know my point was there are too many possibilities as to why 3 versus 7.5
Can you share a couple of those possibilities? Are they scriptural or just guesses?
It seems I hear all the time, "the meaning is spiritual, not physical," "it's spiritual not physical," "You can't interpret that physically, it has a spiritual meaning," "Everything is copy and shadow," "It's copy and shadow"… And now "It doesn't mean anything special."
You know that if the Bible had recorded David's reign as being split 3 and 37, they'd be all over it–"Look how it matches, copy and shadow!"
Why is it that when 'copy and shadow' doesn't work with the wmscog in something that should considering their interpretative (is that a word?) tendencies, they ignore it?
King Xerxes as Father could be wedged to fit very well so why don't we?
genny wrote:
shimon wrote:
I really do not know my point was there are too many possibilities as to why 3 versus 7.5
Can you share a couple of those possibilities? Are they scriptural or just guesses?
It seems I hear all the time, "the meaning is spiritual, not physical," "it's spiritual not physical," "You can't interpret that physically, it has a spiritual meaning," "Everything is copy and shadow," "It's copy and shadow"… And now "It doesn't mean anything special."
You know that if the Bible had recorded David's reign as being split 3 and 37, they'd be all over it–"Look how it matches, copy and shadow!"
Why is it that when 'copy and shadow' doesn't work with the wmscog in something that should considering their interpretative (is that a word?) tendencies, they ignore it?
King Xerxes as Father could be wedged to fit very well so why don't we?
loocpoc wrote:
renita.payno wrote:
Genny:
That's why I shared my thought about shadows. Sometimes the reality isn't what the shadow appeared to be. How can we know which shadows are which kind? Well, when it is explained to you how the 2 hands come together to make the bunny, you can see clearly the shadow/ reality & believe it. But how hard is it to explain something you don't fully know. You're telling me, "The shadow is a bunny. The reality must be a bunny." But I'm telling you, "The reality isn't a bunny at all. They're hands." How can I expect you to believe me? If that's the extent of what I can explain, how could you possibly understand?
There are so many areas in study where the shadow is 1 bunny & the reality are 2 hands. Many lamb sacrifices in the OT represent 1 human sacrifice in the NT. Christians collectively agree on this. You're telling me that 1 man's sacrifice equals over a million lambs, bulls, goats, & heifers sacrifices? Jesus is called the Lamb because He fulfilled the sacrifice of the lamb. Why not be called the Bull of God or the Heifer of God? Why is He referred to as the Lamb of God only? Some parts of prophecy are exact while others are not.
But wasnt there alot more sacrifices after Yeshua?
God didn't accept them though. Even the Talmud records God rejecting the Atonement Sacrifice for forty years before the desutrction of the temple. While I do not accept the Talmud as a good doctrinal source it is still interesting.
loocpoc wrote:
renita.payno wrote:
Genny:
That's why I shared my thought about shadows. Sometimes the reality isn't what the shadow appeared to be. How can we know which shadows are which kind? Well, when it is explained to you how the 2 hands come together to make the bunny, you can see clearly the shadow/ reality & believe it. But how hard is it to explain something you don't fully know. You're telling me, "The shadow is a bunny. The reality must be a bunny." But I'm telling you, "The reality isn't a bunny at all. They're hands." How can I expect you to believe me? If that's the extent of what I can explain, how could you possibly understand?
There are so many areas in study where the shadow is 1 bunny & the reality are 2 hands. Many lamb sacrifices in the OT represent 1 human sacrifice in the NT. Christians collectively agree on this. You're telling me that 1 man's sacrifice equals over a million lambs, bulls, goats, & heifers sacrifices? Jesus is called the Lamb because He fulfilled the sacrifice of the lamb. Why not be called the Bull of God or the Heifer of God? Why is He referred to as the Lamb of God only? Some parts of prophecy are exact while others are not.
But wasnt there alot more sacrifices after Yeshua?
God didn't accept them though. Even the Talmud records God rejecting the Atonement Sacrifice for forty years before the desutrction of the temple. While I do not accept the Talmud as a good doctrinal source it is still interesting.
Idk the sacrifices you're referring to loocpoc.
Idk the sacrifices you're referring to loocpoc.
Will you give examples of sacrifices made by Christians?
Will you give examples of sacrifices made by Christians?
renita.payno wrote:
Genny:
That's why I shared my thought about shadows. Sometimes the reality isn't what the shadow appeared to be. How can we know which shadows are which kind? Well, when it is explained to you how the 2 hands come together to make the bunny, you can see clearly the shadow/ reality & believe it. But how hard is it to explain something you don't fully know. You're telling me, "The shadow is a bunny. The reality must be a bunny." But I'm telling you, "The reality isn't a bunny at all. They're hands." How can I expect you to believe me? If that's the extent of what I can explain, how could you possibly understand?
There are so many areas in study where the shadow is 1 bunny & the reality are 2 hands. Many lamb sacrifices in the OT represent 1 human sacrifice in the NT. Christians collectively agree on this. You're telling me that 1 man's sacrifice equals over a million lambs, bulls, goats, & heifers sacrifices? Jesus is called the Lamb because He fulfilled the sacrifice of the lamb. Why not be called the Bull of God or the Heifer of God? Why is He referred to as the Lamb of God only? Some parts of prophecy are exact while others are not.
Yes, you make a good point.
But the wmscog considers the 30 years old, 40 years preaching to be exact (from 2 Sam. 5). Since the 7 / 33 split is just in the next sentence, so wouldn't you think that in this case these would go together as both exact?
renita.payno wrote:
Genny:
That's why I shared my thought about shadows. Sometimes the reality isn't what the shadow appeared to be. How can we know which shadows are which kind? Well, when it is explained to you how the 2 hands come together to make the bunny, you can see clearly the shadow/ reality & believe it. But how hard is it to explain something you don't fully know. You're telling me, "The shadow is a bunny. The reality must be a bunny." But I'm telling you, "The reality isn't a bunny at all. They're hands." How can I expect you to believe me? If that's the extent of what I can explain, how could you possibly understand?
There are so many areas in study where the shadow is 1 bunny & the reality are 2 hands. Many lamb sacrifices in the OT represent 1 human sacrifice in the NT. Christians collectively agree on this. You're telling me that 1 man's sacrifice equals over a million lambs, bulls, goats, & heifers sacrifices? Jesus is called the Lamb because He fulfilled the sacrifice of the lamb. Why not be called the Bull of God or the Heifer of God? Why is He referred to as the Lamb of God only? Some parts of prophecy are exact while others are not.
Yes, you make a good point.
But the wmscog considers the 30 years old, 40 years preaching to be exact (from 2 Sam. 5). Since the 7 / 33 split is just in the next sentence, so wouldn't you think that in this case these would go together as both exact?
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