Mind Control or the Truth? Pls advise.

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  • #7597
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Hi people,

    yes I m a member in WMSCOG. But i'm kinda new and had only been in for almost a year for now. However please do not slam me as I'm trying to get things right and possibly make an exit outta this church.

    OK my points are that I've seen many weird and inconsistent things in WMSCOG that makes me wanna quit. I missed a couple of saturday sabbaths and the Overseer seems to be annoyed and distance himself from me. I am from Singapore and you know we asians are mostly buddhist and my parents are staunch buddhist. My family persecuted me due to my faith and instead of encouraging me, he might think that I've weak faith. 

    I've seen many people who tried to opposed WMSCOG  being branded as slanderers. I had this brother who gave up his job and preached full time and goes home latenight every day. Therefore his parents were very jealous and wanted him to spend more time with them. However the deacon branded his parents as Church slanderes as they tried to reason with my friend.

    I've also noticed that there are quite alot of parents here who had their child in WMSCOG being branded as slanderers! How can wmscog brand these parents as slanderers where they love their child and were jealous for them?  To me all this makes no sense.

    I find myself very hard to accept ASH and Mother J. I once asked the deacon for any proof of identity or birthcert of Ahn but was rejected. I've also come to known that Ahn's son testified that stating ASH as god is delusional. All the deacon said to me is to avoid the internet as it is likened the tree of good and evil.  

    This seemed to me like brainwashing and information control.

    Take for example, If i want to buy a toyota sedan would I just believe everything what the car saleman told me and buy blindly? Of course not! I would be sane and wise to check forums and reviews before making a purchase! Its only logical and fair.

    Toyota = church

    Carsalesman = wmscog preacher.

     

    Why am i even denied of basic will of thinking and logical reasoning? 

    I am proficient in Conspiracy theories and have been studying conspiracies for more than 10 yrs of my life in the topics of illuminati, freemasonry, cabalism, North korea, rothchilds, green dragons, CIA secret experiments and many more. When I discuss to them regarding these topics the deacon and brothers will just tell me to read only what the bible says. Non of them had any clue about these secret societies. Deep down in me these societies are real and were behind the scenes of world domination and manupilation. What if the WMSCOG is a product of Zionist for mind control?

     

    However…..

    The contradiction is that EASTER, holy communion and christmas are really not of the bible. Although christians can use them as tools to open save unbelievers; deep down in my heart even if  God keeps SILENT on these issues, does he really approve of us to keep all these pagan feast? Is it even right biblically?

    1.RCC had really persecuted millions of christians for keeping passover. Also replacing sunday worship with sabbath.

    2. Many churches today avoid touching on book of revelations and teachings were very shallow.

    3. Its a fact that modern day protestant churches were offshoots of RCC and they carried with them practices of Easter, holy communion and christmas even halloween.

    4. Alot of christians say that salvation is attained through faith alone. If so any person of any faith can goto heaven if his heart is pure and innocent. Even buddhist can go to nirvana just by believing in buddha! I meant no offense to anyonoe of any faith but this is the impression I get.

     

    There are still so many theological inconsistencies that many churches practice today. So even when I'm outta WMSCOG, where should i go?

    Pls tell me that all these ain't real.

    There are too many inconsistencies here and perhaps just highlight to me one or two points would be a good enough reason for me to get outta this pseudo church. I am so confused.

    Yet another point, the other feasts are coming and If wmscog is for real, I would loose my salvation. Should exit now? Forgive me for all the typos, I've typed this in a rush. 

    Please help, is every thing that had been taught to me for real? I seek enlightenment and only the truth. Am i brainwashed? I am so utterly confused! Anyone please enlightment me 🙁

  • #67002

    Smurf
    Participant

    Thanks for your input.

    Now, many ppl here are probably going to start bashing me for saying this, but some of the WMSCOG teachings are correct. However, as you have discovered yourself, many of the stuff they say are out of context. For example, concerning the new name in Reveation they use this verse among others:

    Rev 19:13 .. He (Jesus)has a name written on him that no one knows but he himself.

     This is the only part that you're allowed to read. Why? Because in the very next sentence you see what that name is!

    Rev 19:14 He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God.

    You see, folks, a name isn't always meant as an actual name like Barney or Billy. In many cases in the Bible it is used to represent authority.

    So every now and then you are going to see some truth in this cult, like easter having pagan origins. But you have to understand that this is how they get people!

    They take a lie, wrap it up in some truth to make it more digestible… One big lie, but people will swallow it because the rest of it is true!

     

    My advice is, keep searching! You have seen how they are. Would you stay with them just because there isn't any other organization you can go to?

     

    #67003

    Ms Freedom
    Participant

    Hello mmgateway. Thank you for coming to this site.

    There are several things that define WMSCOG as a cult as opposed to a religion. Cults basically control your whole life. Everything you do is watched by them and if you don't follow their rules, they ridicule, punish or withdraw their attention from you. The outcome of this treatment is to get you to feel bad. When you feel bad you want to do better. Its manipulation pure and simple.

    First of all, your family is not "persecuting" you. That word comes from WMSCOG because they say that persecution is a blessing. They say this to make you think that they were right in warning you about the reaction of your family. Your family is concerned about you and they should be. The WMSCOG has caused separation to thousands of families as have thousands of other cults. They don't want you to be with your family because they will not be able to control you when you are with your family and away from them. Ask yourself this question. What do my parents have to gain by keeping me away from the group? I have spent my whole life with my family and they love me and want what is best for me. They are more wise and have life experience that I don't have. Why would I lose my trust in them and follow a group that I have known for such a short part of my life? Now ask  yourself this question. What does the WMSCOG have to gain by me being a member? The answer is your time, your recruiting capabilities (more members), your devotion (you will protect them against negativity) and most of all – your money. If you can't give them money they look at how many people you can recruit so they can get their money.

    They will also try to control the information that you receive. That is why they tell you to stay off the internet. They know the truth about their organization is here and they don't want their members to see it. You give an excellent example about the car. Why would you only trust what the preacher is telling you when he wants you as a customer? If they really have the truth, everything they are saying and doing will stand up against scrutiny.

    As far as your interest in reading about conspiracy theories – they will not want you to study anything except the things they give you to study.

    They use the word "pagan" to scare you into believing that doing anything pagan is evil. The truth is that everyone follows pagan rituals (including WMSCOG) without even knowing it. The first platform with a speaker and an audience began in pagan meetings – yet you see the pastor preaching from a pulpit and the members sitting in pews or chairs to listen to him – all original pagan. They are quick to call other churches pagan but they have purchased many former Christian churches for their own purposes. If it is so evil, why would they purchase a building where a pagan ritual had taken place. Bottom line – more control. You think of pagan as bad and you want to be good so you avoid everthing they call pagan: holidays, birthdays, etc. They know that holidays bring families together and so they use the word pagan to scare you and keep you with them.

    They say that keeping Sabbath and Passover will get you into heaven but it only gets you into their control. I won't get into the Bible us vs. them about Sabbath because it really isn't about the Bible – its about their control. Ask yourself – Do they try to make me feel guilty about missing services? How many other things do they make you feel guilt about – more control. Have they told you to pray more, fast, give more, work harder, preach more? If you believe you need to do these things they are controlling your behavior.

    Your 4th point about about "faith alone" refers to believing in Christ alone. I don't believe Buddist follow the Bible so according to the Bible you would have to believe in Christ alone in order to get to heaven.

    Please understand – this group has been scamming people for 30 years. They have heard every disagreement that people have come up with and they have a comeback and an excuse/answer for everything. That should be another red flag. No body and no religion has the answers to everything.

    I have spent the last 2 years researching about cults, bad churches, mind control and brainwashing. WMSCOG fits the description of a cult in everything I have read. I can tell you from my own experience that they have caused so much pain to my family. I have spent hundreds of night crying for my child who has no communication with us now. If this is the truth, why does it cause so much pain to so many people? Isn't god supposed to offer love to everyone?

    My suggestion to you is to stop your involvement with them. You will be bombarded with phone calls, visits and text messages. They will try to make you feel like you're going to go to hell if you don't return. They will tell you that the end is near and you will not be protected when the end happens. And if you don't give into that – they will shun you. They will tell their members to cut off all contact with you and you will be avoided at all costs.

    I can't tell you which faith or religion to choose. But I do know it should be your own choice; you should not be pressured or manipulated into joining anything. And yes – WMSCOG is based on lies. You are being scammed.

    #67004

    Azula
    Participant

    Ms Freedom wrote:

    Hello mmgateway. Thank you for coming to this site.

    There are several things that define WMSCOG as a cult as opposed to a religion. Cults basically control your whole life. Everything you do is watched by them and if you don't follow their rules, they ridicule, punish or withdraw their attention from you. The outcome of this treatment is to get you to feel bad. When you feel bad you want to do better. Its manipulation pure and simple.

     

    Ask yourself this question. What do my parents have to gain by keeping me away from the group? I have spent my whole life with my family and they love me and want what is best for me. They are more wise and have life experience that I don't have. Why would I lose my trust in them and follow a group that I have known for such a short part of my life

    I think the above points are the most important ones to answer. People whom you've known and have loved for such a long time in what seems to be almost an instant have become your enemies. Another important point is that this "church" makes you believe that you have to earn God's love by keeping his commands. Like grace is earned! If it were then it would cease to be grace. Here is a perfcet example of control.

    Why is the attendance measured? The amount of services that you kept in the week, the month, the year? The amount of preaching meetings you have attended, your fruits? Why are these measured? And are later used as ways to dsitinguish between a weak and strong believer? Sounds more like a corporation than a church.

    It's according to their claim that the earthly system is modeled after the heavenly one right? And that it was father and mother who created men in their images.

    At which point did your "earthly" parents ever make you feel like their LOVE was anything you had to EARN? Think about it seriously and you'll see that all that they want is to control you for power and for money. Think about the amount of shame and guilt you get (and even if they may not have said anything but look at their behaviour) if you are 1 minute late for a Sabbath service. Do you ever feel like you can be truly free with these people? Like you are trusted?

    #67005

    Joshua
    Participant

    I want to give you five warning signs of corruption in religion. I will disclose right now that I am bias and I don't believe that God came to earth to establish a religion! I believe He came to establish a relationship with us. I don't like religion!

    1) Absolute Truth Claims

    2) Blind Obedience

    3) Establishing the "Ideal" time

    4) The End Justifies Any Means

    5) Declaring Holy War

    These topics are not exclusive to the WMSCOG but generally cover religious cults. Thinking about the WMSCOG and these topics does produce the idea that the WMSCOG falls into the idea of a corrupt religion. Do they have "Absolute Truth Claims"? We all know that they do! What about the expectation of "Blind Obedience"? How many families have been effected by the demands of the WMSCOG in reguards to this? What about the "Establishing the Ideal Time"? Members are trapped by this one all of the time! Father will be back at anytime and you don't want to be found outside of zion when he returns. Sure sounds like the time is now. This next one "The Ends Justifies Any Means" ticks me off and at the same time scares me a little. I have had members tell me directly the God can do whatever He wants including lie. So they feel that they can lie to people to get them into the group and believing what they feel is right. I don't know where you're at right now but I would rather know the truth than be lured into something with a lie. Finally, "Declaring Holy War" probably better known as "It's Us Against Them" mentality. We have the truth and unless they believe like us then they are the enemy. This is group think all of the way! This stuff leads straight to bondage. I have yet to meet anyone that had escaped from a controlling group who would willingly go right back into it! Once people know the truth and get free of something like this they never seem to go back. Inside of the group they would say something like, "So and so has strayed from the truth" and would encourage people not to talk to the person who left. They would lose more people if members would talk to ex-members. This tactic is better called self preservation. Please take this information, do your own research outside of the influences of the group, and set yourself free.

    #67006

    emil
    Participant

    You have correctly identified the problems of the wmscog. However, when coming to other churches and the 4 points you have made, those points are either complete lies or misrepresntations of the truth. I guess the seed of those points comes from the wmscog itself.

    #67007

    Joshua
    Participant

    I guess you didn't read this very well. Go ahead and take a second look at it. You'll find that it describes how religion becomes corrupt not that all churches are corrupt. BTW, there are five points listed above and none of them are from the WMSCOG. I'm sure that they are not happy with the way we call them out on this stuff. Have a great day.

    #67008

    emil
    Participant

    Joshua you misunderstood me. I was not refering to your 5 points. I was refering to the 4 points in the original post, which are basiclly regurgitated wmscog rubbish.

    #67009

    Simon
    Participant

    mmgateway wrote:

    1.RCC had really persecuted millions of christians for keeping passover. Also replacing sunday worship with sabbath.

    RCC in history may have persecuted people for things but keeping passover is not one of them. So far as sunday and Sabbath the early church met every day according to the book of Acts and kept the bread and wine daily as well.

    2. Many churches today avoid touching on book of revelations and teachings were very shallow.

     Revelation is a complex book its better to touch on it as carefully as possible rather than boldly proclaim nontruth about it

    3. Its a fact that modern day protestant churches were offshoots of RCC and they carried with them practices of Easter, holy communion and christmas even halloween.

    Easter is Biblical as far as the timing the name is debatable but then maybe we shouldn't call God "God" either by the same reasoning

    Christmas is not biblical this is true but I am not convinced it is anti-biblical either.

    Communion is of course excedingly Biblical the notion that it should be kept on Passover only contradicts a few accounts 

    4. Alot of christians say that salvation is attained through faith alone. If so any person of any faith can goto heaven if his heart is pure and innocent. Even buddhist can go to nirvana just by believing in buddha! I meant no offense to anyonoe of any faith but this is the impression I get.

     Faith alone does't mean faith in anything but in Yehovah/Jesus so no not of any faith

     

     

    More importantly you cannot hesitate to take the first step because you do not know the last step.. I still do not know the last step but I left and am continuing to find my path day by day

    #67010

    emil
    Participant

    @Simon – excellent response

    #67011

    Anonymous
    Guest

    Hi people,

    Really appreciate your comments and advices. I appologise for the late reply as I was terribly busy. I've finally made a stand to exit this church and last month as praise the lord I'm a freeman. I'm gonna get myself rebaptised in a local church.  

    **** Mother J and WMSCOG for nearly destroying my relationship with my fiancee.

    I've finally came up with a list of conclusion why members should exit WMSCOG as soon as possible.

    1. I've seen my fellow member's familybeing torn apart by this cult. His parents refused to believed in ASH and my friend calls them partakers of the devil (Satan). I used to think like this but now when I think again, Who on earth will think of their parents as devils?

    2. If  Mother J loves you so much, why weren't you even allowed to go visit her? 

    3. Toddlers and even infants were forced to participate in the feast of god. Can they even understand?

    4. Extreme time commitment.you're encouage to go bible study sessions almost every day. You're also encourage to preach daily as "the end is near" and you're told to bear 10 talents. I've seen my friend who tried to preach at all cost, sacrificing away precious time with loved ones and family.

    5. Self Denial. They always make you think that you're unworthy and undeserving of ASH's mercy. ASH didn't even declare himself as God or Mother J as female god. God is merciful and is not there to destroy you, depive you or to make you dread and fearful of him like what WMSCOG members are.

    6. Complete mind control your mind. They tell you to trust and obey what they have taught you 100%. "Any self thought and opinion is of the devil." 

    7. The deacon indirectly discouraged my wedding with my fiancee as it will hinder my faith in ASH nd mother J. Scew WMSCOG.

    8. Weird arranged marriages by the cult upon a their members. I witnessed my own friend being arranged for marriage with a sister whom he had ever knew.

    9. Like what hassan had said, Information control (BITE model). All members were discourage to find any thing online or offline about WMSCOG. Extremes of even telling members to abstain from lisitening  to music, watching TV, playing computer games and many others as i will hinder you from doing gospel work or drive you away from salvation.

    10. Church (WMSCOG) above all. The Chuch (WMSCOG) dictates your life. You're don't have discrepency of going for a holiday with your loved ones, attending a funeral, attending a function or wedding…etc..  I was being told to attend a local brunch in australia when I told them i want to go for a holiday trip to Aussie with my fiancee. They even want to dictate my pre honeymoon holiday and told me not to miss a sabbath.

    Your rightful priority should be your family and loved ones first before the church. 

     

    To all WMSCOG members….. If you've brains please think for yourself for once.

    #67012

    remco9519
    Participant


    @anonymous
    :  congratulations.  what about those conspiracy theories u read any developments? corporate media say conspiracy theories.  i and jesse ventura say they are conspiracy facts. what ur thinking is that there maybe possibility that this group is a spring of the Agenda21 NWO. truth will surface on top of falsehood always.  ok, what i know of this WMSCOG is one of the new age movement, deceits, deceptions, lies, disinformation and all the filthiest activities of mankind leading to mankinds destruction of morals and spiritual awareness and welfare degradation, self destruction u name it. this are but a few of the functions of this group.  behind there is that support they get. is it not that in cospiracy theory the NWO target is to kill 80 to 90% of the world's population? was it a theory, no its a fact and before people were made aware fully of the plan, NWO people already have started killing relentlessly.  Where? Iraq, afghanistan, palestine, ukraine, canada??  (go to itccs.org you maybe interested with that genocide discovery prompting the resignation of the pope). UN and WHO being hide outs of these criminals, distributed relief medicines contaminated with viruses and children most especially died because of these injections. Its still early though to conclude a relationship of NWO and WMSCOG but so far as religion is concerned,  NWO includes a one world religion in its agenda.    

    #67013

    Simon
    Participant

    Crazy debunked conspiracy theory pushing only makes us look bad please realize those aren't legitmate and bring up the legitimate concerns.

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