- Topic
As the years have gone by I have had the opportunity to share in the lives of several people who have exited or who were in the process of coming out of the WMSCOG. These people overall are very cool and I am glad to have had the opportunity to share my time with them. There have been plenty of things that we have not agreed on and some thing that we have. Recently I was having a conversation with a friend and former member about how the WMSCOG uses reasoning to keep their members trapped. The question always goes like this, "If the WMSCOG does not have the truth then where should I go to study?" They usually add things like, "Passover, Feast, Special Prayer Times, Prophesy,…". For those of you that have visited the forum here for any length of time I'm sure that you have noticed that I will not give a specific recommendation for a church or a group for someone to go study with. I do share that I am a Christian and that I go to a non-denominational church. This is by my own free will that I choose to do this. How do I answer the question of where to go to study if not at the WMSCOG? By the time they ask this question they already know that there is something wrong with the WMSCOG and its studies and doctrine. I suggest that they find a group or church to get involved in and research everything that they find questionable when it comes up. Most places and people will be acceptable to someone honestly asking questions about what they're hearing. If they are not, then this is probably a place that you don't want to be involved with.
Am I going to tell someone that they have to go to XYZ church or become a member of XYZ group?
Let me put it too you this way, "How easy and perfect is my life that I get to tell you how you should live yours?"
Give yourselves some options and get out from under the dictatorship of control groups like the WMSCOG. Keep researching, don't let anyone spoon feed you what they think you should know. This even includes the advice you get from me. I'm not perfect I'm just trying to help what's more I'm not opposed to being corrected from time to time.
P.S. To the members and former members that I am friends with thank you! You hold a very special place in my heart.
Prrsonally, after 4 years in WMS, I need s break. I have faith, and beleive that man didnt honestly evolve from primortal ooze, but structured religion entirely scares me. Im just learning the both sides to the coin so to speak
As far a “Religion” goes for me, now I have been looking into Self awareness, Budhism (on the Philosophical standpoint) and just looking into Christs points. Ive been to many churches before WMS, and I feel again as I felt then, they get away from CHRIST. I can honestly say staying focused to the point id the discussion, the members at WMS that I had bonds with were good people. Many of them, were just truth seekers. Heck, many of them (and I do mean many) had issues with the doctrine, the leaders and the hypocrisy, but they just lacked the courage to leave. If many of then had more courage, I would love to reconnect.
As for me I don’t know if there is an ideal place to go after the WMS. I’m just getting back into my old routine, more work and less religion. No matter what church you go to you get to receive their teachings and doctrine. I’m still going out and meeting people to have bible discussions and study that is separate from the churches. The bible is still our lamp. Psalms 119:105
6 years in the WMSCOG. 3 full years and about 3 broken years after that (going back and forth and trying to fake it to make it, while sometimes actually doing the work…if that makes any sense)
For me this site has helped a lot. The only former members I talk to are you all. The current members are my family. Which is super tough. I've shared in the past that my thearpist believes I suffer from CPTSD. I've ran the gambit of high risk behavior and at the moment I'm cleaning up the fall out. I've searched and searched. I always tell people when I talk about my testimony, is the actuall fall away from the COG and the outcome.. When I fell away I fell away very sudden. My "rudder" that had been guiding my life (I was a Christian before the COG), was now gone! I really didn't understand the maginutude of what I was embarking on. So like most rash actions they tend to lead to a lot of difficulties. I was a "rudderless" man for quite some time. I believe this is why I kept coming back to COG time and time again…as said above in the broken time description. Ah man so where am I at now? Kinda like Cain from Kung Fu. haha. I've had a lot of moment of clarity's. My most recent one is truly a revelation. I know that a man, women, child, what ever needs to have some sort of guiding force….whether spiritual, metaphysical, or situational. I know you can just "roam, or float". You have to have that rudder and I guess I'm searching …and when I say searching…I MEAN SEARCHING….lol . So yea that place really screwed me up big time. I'm not ashamed to admit it. However the grieving for me has to stop. It's done nothing. However they've (COG) gained everything. My family. I don't know if they will ever make the effort to "look behind the curtain" and see the real "Oz". For me though I got to start swimming.
Thanks again for this site.
Keep swimming LoG! You are getting there. I can already see an improvement in you, just the difference in the way you talk compared to how you were when you first came on the site. I agree, too, that at some point you have to stop grieving. That has been the hardest for me, too.
You are stronger than you think! Hang in there, and please keep coming here for support. We certainly will give it to you.
LoG – I want to encourage you to look inside yourself. Take a break from searching and just really dig deep inside yourself. You have the strength inside – you just need to pull it up. Everything that you gave mother and father credit for when you were a member – was really you! You worked hard, you helped people – it was not their strength – IT WAS YOUR STRENGTH!
You have to start "self-loving" and forgive yourself for being deceived. The great thing is – you will be much wiser when going forward in your life. And you can make it a great life. As MM said, "You are stronger than you think!"
And you have us:)
Thanks Mountain Mom and Ms Freedom. I totally agree. Thanks again.
I remember Passover of 2012. I was deployed and I remember my wife before I left (Dec 2011) was crying …..so convinced that I wouldn't make it home due to the final disasters. I had already fallen way and came back a few times. I remember feeling so beat up inside. However I remember telling her like "c'mon you seriously believe this is going to happen?" I remember her going into the house and telling the kids…" y' know your dad dosen't believe the disasters are going to come next year". Lol. Funny thinking back on it now. I remember when I finally fell away the last time I brought this up to her. Her mind was completly wiped clean of it. She denied and still does. I feel bad because I know it's because of the systematic and slow drip mind control IV this church possesss. Ah…anyways. Just wanted to share that.
@LambofGod: It is so funny how their memory gets erased. My son also denies that he told me the world was going to end. My husband and I both heard it from him and other members, but now he denies it. It's a phenomenon, isn't it.@Lamb I see many members who are still in, beleive the excuses they made for 2012 not happening. “It only signified the building of the temple” etc. I have heard 2012 prophecy as well. We were all told that 2012 was the end.
Yea I know. I kick myself in the teeth at times for not recording a lot of these studies. In the early times at San Diego they didn't have the strictest of rules. We just simply "obeyed" when Pastor Brian would say…"no note taking". That should've raised some flags for me. I do remember after the study feeling doomed. I wasn't happy or ready. I always felt back then that I was on another path. Even when I was devout to father and mother. I didn't want the world to end. I wanted to get old and see my kids grow and have grand kids. When I would tell some of the brothers this, they would laugh. Don't you want to be an angel in heaven kicking stars like a soccer ball….have your own galaxy? I really didn't. So that is nother reason why that study is burned into my mind. I will never forget it. We made so many poor financial choices due to the fact we believed the world was going to end. I remember when I reenlisted for another 4 years a lot of the brothers were like "brother why…..the disasters are coming, you need to be able to spend as much time in zion as possible"… San Diego had a lot of brothers and sisters that were in the military. A lot of them got out for this main reason. 2012. As the year began to get closer and closer I'm sure they already convinced themselves it was for the gospel work. Anyways when I talk to my family about this I'm always left feeling like "I'm the crazy one…and there is something wrong with me". Its so bad now that I don't even see the resemblence of any Christ like traits in her. Not to sound judgemental….I know I have a lot of issues and bad habits. When I say that I don't see the love of God that I do in other Christians I meet. Even though I don't believe in a "god"…I respect those folks that have that deep love for all people. I don't see that in COG. That's enough for now…lol. Didnt' mean to soapbox.
LambofGod wrote:
Yea I know. I kick myself in the teeth at times for not recording a lot of these studies. In the early times at San Diego they didn't have the strictest of rules. We just simply "obeyed" when Pastor Brian would say…"no note taking". That should've raised some flags for me. I do remember after the study feeling doomed. I wasn't happy or ready. I always felt back then that I was on another path. Even when I was devout to father and mother. I didn't want the world to end. I wanted to get old and see my kids grow and have grand kids. When I would tell some of the brothers this, they would laugh. Don't you want to be an angel in heaven kicking stars like a soccer ball….have your own galaxy? I really didn't. So that is nother reason why that study is burned into my mind. I will never forget it. We made so many poor financial choices due to the fact we believed the world was going to end. I remember when I reenlisted for another 4 years a lot of the brothers were like "brother why…..the disasters are coming, you need to be able to spend as much time in zion as possible"… San Diego had a lot of brothers and sisters that were in the military. A lot of them got out for this main reason. 2012. As the year began to get closer and closer I'm sure they already convinced themselves it was for the gospel work. Anyways when I talk to my family about this I'm always left feeling like "I'm the crazy one…and there is something wrong with me". Its so bad now that I don't even see the resemblence of any Christ like traits in her. Not to sound judgemental….I know I have a lot of issues and bad habits. When I say that I don't see the love of God that I do in other Christians I meet. Even though I don't believe in a "god"…I respect those folks that have that deep love for all people. I don't see that in COG. That's enough for now…lol. Didnt' mean to soapbox.
I am glad you post here, LofG: I don't feel like you are on a soapbox, I feel like you are giving valuable information while at the same time talking this all out in your mind. That's a good thing. I am assuming you are talking about Brian Park when you refer to Pastor Brian. He is now the pastor at the Naperville, Illinois church.
I do have a paper that tells how they figured the 2012 date out. Of course, it doesn't matter. My son told me out and out that 2012 was the end of the world. Now he denies it. He says, "Some members misunderstood." Some, heck! Try ALL of them at that time (2009).
@LoG.. Your not the only one. Im relatively Atheist now. I do rely and beleive in moral reasoning that goes to one thought; “Do no harm”. I wish I took more notes on 2012 as well, but I honestly think its in my house somewhere. I also feel crazy. Since coming out, I use alot of my job Earned time, living life; spending time with my wife and kids. I literally tried to tell my Supervisor, and close coworkers that, “I just came out of a cult”. I get some strange responses. Some who moderately understand say to me, “How did you let that happen?”. Outside of this Forum, and reaching out to Exmembers who I’ve spoken to on the phone (Ron Ramos, Brian Taylor and Chris Herbert), I have no person to speak about WMS thought/feelings with. My wife has a different standpoint, and is simply moving forward with her life. If you ever need to reach out, we are here.
@mountain I would love to peak at those 2012 prophecy notes you have.
@Untouchable: The notes are in Korean, but I had someone interpret them. And the dates are clearly marked on how they figured out the end date. 2012 is very clearly stated. PM me and I will send you a copy. I got it from a seminar by a cult expert several years ago. (2010) He gave one of the first talks in the states on the Wms, which he accurately called a "Doomsday Cult."
@Untouchable: also, only people who don't understand cults would ask you why you let this happen. They would have been hooked in the same as you were under the same circumstances. Some really great and intelligent people have fallen prey to groups like the Wms. You and your wife are two of those great and intelligent people I am talking about. So is my son.
Keep talking to us here on the forum. We know exactly what you have gone through. We understand, for sure. And we celebrate with you on your freedom now!
@Mountain *Hugs* Your the best. Someday, I will do my own YT video. I have a list of folks from my old “Zion” who I know, would leave. They’re frustrated faces, come to mind. And I was watched because members would speak openly about frustrations to me, ofteb in secret. It seems after the Overseer would scream and yell at someone, a few of us would be in the mens room discussing how rude he was. Call it Godless chatter, but I mastered it. Because yelling at someone for mopping the wood floor without wringing out the Mop well enough, is pretty Godless to. I will continue to speak on here. Just bare in mind Im a “long story”, so you’ll have lots to read when I tell a story, lol!!
Yelling because you didn't wring the mop out? Sounds evil. I think its a cultural thing. That man from the far East, not the east, but far east. I have a friend whose boss does the exact same thing. Both are not related to the cog.
@Mayor Yeah. I have come to the conclussion that the Korean overseers are trained that way. My old Partner at work is Korean, and he is very Soft spoken. I have also seen the Boston Overseer, and he is pretty quiet and kind. We also had a Korean couple my first year in, and they were two of the kindest people I ever met. Wether they are taught to treat Americans this way or just in general, they are arrogant, rude and nasty. He yelled at members for slouching. He yelled at members for so many things, and everyone just took it.
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