- Topic
Simply wondering how long each of the ex members or loved ones had been involved with cog and were able to break free even after however long or short term!!?? I’m sure this varies..
I broke free about a year ago after being involved for 2 and a half years. The whole time I was there I questioned and doubted but I just suppressed them. Alot of the time it was easy to suppress because I always thought it was only me who had doubts. Whenever I saw a video or heard a sermon that didn't make sense, but everyone else would say AMEN after I would just join and say AMEN because I didn't want to feel like I was the only one who didn't understand. Sometimes I think the use of the word AMEN in there was some type of mechanism to get us back into group think. This website helped me alot and people on here like Joshua helped with the knowledge that they posted on here. My mother and and a friend of mine also helped. Taking a religious studies class while in the World Mission Society also opened my mind to historical inaccuracies.
In the wms though some of the red flags I had were: 1. Being taught how to deceive people. 2. The corny videos they use to show that never made sense. Like the one they showed trying to explain why Ahnsahnghong said there was no God the mother. 3. The constant obsession with bringing in people. 4. Getting points for bringing in people, and making a competition out of bringing in members. The group that gets the most fruit get a prize. This upset me because I thought we were to preach out of love and not for points. 5. Once before an education training having to sign a paper saying that we wouldn't continue friendships made during the training outside of the organization. 6. Being told how Father and Mother suffered then to find out it was a lie. Like how Father broke rocks and Mothers dress feels like cardboard 7. Confronting them with accurate Bible history and getting no proper answer. Their response was you are saying that to say what? Confronting them about the inaccuracies of the NIV version of the Bible and still no response. 8. Being told they never taught 2012, to it meant temple complete, to we have to wait for Mother to tell us. 9. Being told that Ron Ramos was upset because he was demoted due to sexual immorality to being told he was upset because they wouldn't promote him to Pastor to he was offered a position in the NCPCOG. 10. Having to destroy certain videos after they were watched with no proper explanation as to why. Just Mother said so and we wouldn't want someone stealing them. 11. Ahnsahnghong saying that the New Jerusalem was a city 12. Ahnsahnghong saying that there was no God the Mother. And the list goes on. At the end none of it just added up and nothing they said made sense to me.
@Warrior. I said that to. I would tell my friends I know Father and Mother is God I'm never leaving I'm a million percent sure. I use to say it to convince myself that I believed it. The fact that he has been in for 2 years he should start seeing inconsistencies if he hasn't already. I started seeing them after 1 year. However, even after seeing inconsistencies it is difficult to leave because of all the fears and phobias that they put in you. For the longest I thought I was going to hell if I left, I felt where else would I go and what would I do if I left. I thought those same things after leaving because my life became so interwined in the organization. It became my reason for existence and it made it extremely difficult to leave. I changed my entire life for the organization. I lost friends, money, time, energy, and purpose. Depending on how much your husband has given up it could be the same. The thing is though that everyone has different personalities, so the reason for people leaving or staying is always different. The best thing my family could have ever done for me was just love me. My mother never attacked the church or shunned me she just showed support and also planted seeds of doubt when she could. That's what really worked with me. I never told anyone I doubted and always acted like what they said didn't cause doubt but it did. On the other hand people who would say things against the church such as its a cult, or I drunk the kool-aid caused me to feel that the church was the truth because everyone was against it.@WarriorQueen. I could almost mirror Selena’s testimony. My experiences had little Breadcrumb effects that spilled over. For me, the first was the odd behaviors. Although they seemed happy they always seemed unrealistic, everything was a, “Wow” or “Amen like a kindergarten class. I was very early on, privy to the fact they assign people to watch you. I was rumored in my first 3months or so, to be hanging out with a “brother”. They assigned a woman, whom is now a deaconess to watch me. Im in the Juvenile field, so Im trained to be observant, and it carries over to outside my job. This woman was the worst. I would catch her hovering around me etc. The second was the secrecy. You only found out about things as you stumbled on them. My spouse asked the overseers Korean wife how they met, “Oh we met in Korea.” And then the subject was changed.
3rd, was the Ron Ramos video. When Ron said, “Its not what they say, its what they DONT say…” I was in full agreement. The guilt trips, the diversion from truth, etc. That stuck with me. 4, like Selena said was the “Problems with the New Jerusalem” video. Them trying to say, “Father had to write the book to protect his children”. I couldnt get past the fact that they justified a lie. 5. Was the Overseers conduct. My 3rd Overseer was Korean, and he was rude, arrogant and made excuses for his behavior. He openly yelled at members, made racially charged comments and jokes (he LOVED telling Black members, “Dont act Niggardly”)and made fun of members with issues. I wondered, how could God send this man? Most of the other members just accepted it. 6. Inconsistencies in doctrine. When I found a flaw once, in a sermon for preaching, I was told to not show it to anyone. When I did leave there were a TON of other things I found that they hid. We were never shown “Problems with the New Jerusalem” book by Ahn. it CLEARLY states how ASH didnt believe in God the mother. The fact that ASH wrote alot more books, helped me to realize that WMS didnt have the copyrights to his material. Also, they show a movie calles Fathers Sacrifice. In it like all the movies, they make ASH seem to be this toiling poor man who lived in a shack. You can clearly fins pics, to understand ASH was married, so where were his Wife and kids when he was busting stones at a quarry (Not sure on this, but I also heard Ahn only worked breaking stones for a few months). One video that was new, that we saw right before I left, had Zhang telling a story from a early church member who claimed ASH lived in a one bedroom shanty shack with rat droppings in the ceiling. Again, where were his wife and kids?
* Bonus* A big redflag for me was having to sign a confidentiality agreement. Many exmembers were asked to sign this document saying we wouldnt talk about the WMS issues. Why would the True church do this? Jesus and Apostle Paul expressly frowned apon Church
suing as it is more of a worldy practice. But WMS sues exmembers at the drop of a hat.
@Warrior. We were there for 4years. Yes, Overseers differ. Our 2nd Overseer was just a generally good guy. The last one was a dictator. Here is something to maybe share when he is in a space to listen; Why isn’t Rons claim(s) worth investigating? Because someone ELSE told you something is a lie…does it make it a lie? I have experienced some of the things Ron has stated. 2012 prophecy was one of them.
@warrior I would advise studying this site. It sounds like you guys are pretty open, and maybe these are light debates, and not screaming matches. Again, I have heard the 2012 Prophecy. Etc. What Ron and Diane were hitting on, was that WMS major trick ia NOT writing things down. So when they say to a female member, “Why would you have a baby in these last days?”..its their word against the member. I dont know how open he is to seeing varyinf points, but I have learned that initiating arguments with them isnt successful. When we were on the fence, we reached out to a former member. He and his wife also experienced the Confidentiality Agreements, 2012 failed Prophecy, Inconsistency in Doctrine etc. The breaking point for many of us, was Ulm Soon and Ahns book “Problems with the New Jerusalem and womens veils”. Ask him why the church hasnt any copies to read? The reason is because it is very clear about Ahns standpoint. Maybe ask hiM this;
“Can God lie?”
If he can’t, why did he LIE and state there wasnt a Mother God if there is? Help him to understand its a lie. Humans…you and I can tell “lil white lies”. But if God can’t then ASH isnt God. Period. Also show him this link
http://www.ncpcog.net/eng/?p=1
Ita a picture of Ahn praying over the passover. In the backgrouns is the NCPCOG seal on a banner. Why is this important? WMS claims The NCPCOG split from the WMS. This is a lie. Ahn founded the NCPCOG. The WMS only has six of his “truth” books, and NCPCOG has all of them, AND all his notes. Maybe this will help.
@Warrior, they honestly have answers for everything scriptural and since everyone outside of the church is considered to be in Babylon we can't possibly have an accurate understanding because they have the only "truth". Most people who come out come out due to inconsistencies they saw for themselves. I can't remember what in particular people would say to me to plant doubt but I remember my mom and one of my friends were always supportive and never said anything against it. But again I was struggling with the doctrine myself. I use to tell my friend I'm never leaving the truth, what you are telling me doesn't matter. Maybe if you told me that when I had weak faith I would have believed you. However, I only said these things to suppress the way I felt inside. I thought I was the only one doubting and something was wrong with me. I remember once the overseer asked who was sure they were going to Heaven. Out of over 100 people only two answered amen. That shows most people in there, or in the location I was at are uncertain about if they are going to Heaven. But I thought they had the truth so then if thats the case you should be certain.It also depends on a persons personality. I always had the attitude that if your faith can't be challenged what good is it. Of course, they believe something else. However, that attitude helped me alot because I listened to what other people had to say. I would preach to Pastors and people well versed in the Bible even though they told us not to because I felt well everyone needs to be saved. The best thing I believe you can do is just try to be supportive. People I love dearly are still in the World Mission Society but at the end of the day they are adults and have to make their own decisions. And as much as I love them I can't force them to believe anything that I say. So unless they begin questioning for themselves, in my opinion all you can do is love them and keep the lines of communication open. There's also nothing wrong with asking questions.
@Untouchable. I had forgotten about how they use to watch people. I remember so many times that they would eavesdrop on members conversations. Or come up and ask what are we talking about? Sometimes sisters would talk to me about personal matters and someone would always come up and say we don't talk about such things in zion or try to get me to tell them the sisters personal business after the sister left but I always told them you have to ask them.
@Selena Your story reminds me of mine. I think your advice was the best. @WarriorQueen Just love your husband. They want you to become advesarial so that if things get rocky, they can keep him and tighten their grip. They also have a trick for non beleiving spouses. They have been known to give them a title or greater responsibility that will suck up more time. All in all, I like Selena’s advice. Wms has so many members who have varying levels of doubt. I talked to many of the members when I was there and like Selena stated, you could tell. Plus for an organization run by “God”, they put some very crookes people in leadership and poor behaviour rarely goes unchecked.
@Warrior They denied the pic? Sheesh..thats the NCPCOG logo, in a picture from the 80’s. It cant get more authentic.
Korean translates differently. Sigh…the brainwashing is strong.
BTW, the logo cane from the NCPCOG site…so seems like his Overseer told a lie.
From later understanding, its clear that AHN believed the world would end, and that he was Elijah who would come before the grewt tribulations then judgment. Since that didnt happen, and his congregation held him in such high regard, I think General Pastor felt that since Elijah comes before God, maybe Ahn was God. The NCPCOG/original church knew that was bologne and sent Cheol and Zhang packing. But since Zhang was Ahns side girlfriend, she probably felt that she was Jerusalem God. There was a picture that WMS showed us of Ahn wearing the Animal skin jacket and Leather Belt. They even stated that he was Elijah. I think they only did that so no member would stumble upon it. In this society, thats what people learn to do. An athlete caught using PEDs or Steroids will come out and address it before the media does. He’ll apologize and most people believe him. Charlie Sheen, even came out and stated his HIV situation before the press, and look how quickly we have forgotten.
WMS does the same;
“Ahn predicted the end of the World in 1988, but its prophecy, he had to”
“Father wrote a book stating there is no Mother God, if he hadnt then we would all die a spiritual death”.
These are all tactics, tricks of deception. Why would the truth need to be ssoooo secretive? Because deep down, Cheol and Zhang know they are lying. They are probably two people who think they are bringing a sense of hope or morality to a broken world, but playing “God” is wrong and has major repercussions on a persons mind.
untouchable j GOD THE MOTHER says your going to burn in hell forever . so keep typing about the church your a lame and a bloodsucking leech
JAMAL wrote:
untouchable j GOD THE MOTHER says your going to burn in hell forever . so keep typing about the church your a lame and a bloodsucking leech
Lol! Please do keep typing Untouchable! You must really be getting to them by exposing the truth or they wouldn't be trying so hard to get you to stop talking. Also, they are obviously sending you some kind of veiled threat.
Calling names is a very typical Wms response, and very juvenile. It is how they treat former members who were their best friends while in the church, but don't even warrant a "hello" from a member afterwards.
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