- Topic
I've seen comments about this scattered throughout the forum before, but I'd like to gather the information together. It will help with something I'm working on.
Whether you experienced it as a member or saw it in your loved one who is/was a member…
1. On major holidays (such as Christmas, Thanksgiving, Halloween, etc.) did your wmscog congregation get together for an alternative gathering? (Like how many churches offer a "Harvest Festival" on Halloween night.)
2. Which holidays did they do this for?
3. Was it advertised as a community event, or just for members?
4. What was the event like? (organized, relaxed, potluck, fellowship, preaching…)
5. Which holidays (if any) were you (or your loved one) willing to celebrate with your family in the regular way.
Thank you so much for sharing!
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By the way, here's my own answer…
My sister and I live far apart and mostly talk on the phone, so I do not have opportunity to see what she does on particular holidays or if there are any alternate holiday arrangements.
I do know that she sometimes visited for Thanksgiving dinner, and she joined the family when we all came to the same town to be together for Christmas. However, we never have our family Christmas gathering on Dec. 25. It's always early, and though she would eat, she would not exchange presents with us or wish us Merry Christmas. She was just there to visit. Since I never see her on Dec. 25, I don't know what she does that day.
She has always been willing to wish us Happy New Year or Happy Birthday.
genny wrote:
I've seen comments about this scattered throughout the forum before, but I'd like to gather the information together. It will help with something I'm working on.
Whether you experienced it as a member or saw it in your loved one who is/was a member…
1. On major holidays (such as Christmas, Thanksgiving, Halloween, etc.) did your wmscog congregation get together for an alternative gathering? (Like how many churches offer a "Harvest Festival" on Halloween night.)
2. Which holidays did they do this for?
3. Was it advertised as a community event, or just for members?
4. What was the event like? (organized, relaxed, potluck, fellowship, preaching…)
5. Which holidays (if any) were you (or your loved one) willing to celebrate with your family in the regular way.
Thank you so much for sharing!
—-
By the way, here's my own answer…
My sister and I live far apart and mostly talk on the phone, so I do not have opportunity to see what she does on particular holidays or if there are any alternate holiday arrangements.
I do know that she sometimes visited for Thanksgiving dinner, and she joined the family when we all came to the same town to be together for Christmas. However, we never have our family Christmas gathering on Dec. 25. It's always early, and though she would eat, she would not exchange presents with us or wish us Merry Christmas. She was just there to visit. Since I never see her on Dec. 25, I don't know what she does that day.
She has always been willing to wish us Happy New Year or Happy Birthday.
1. Yes
2. Christmas, New Year's, Halloween, Thanksgiving, Mother's Day, Father's Day
3. Members plus their guests. It wasn't advertised as open to the public
4. Really fun, actually. Played games.. studied.. ate.. watched movies approved by Zhang.. It wasn't like a service or Feast.
5. Thanksgiving
@love So true. They even have a double standard when it comes to scripture.
@hurt To go back to your statement/question. The Koreans never, said they were superior, but the statwments they would sometimes make shows their mindset (not all). I have a good friend who is Korean. As being on par with other East Asian countries, the Koreans are drab, to some exstent. Japanese for example have a very diverse hip culture (they love hip hop, dye their hair etc) so it would seem that Korean Overseers act as if Western ideal are super strange. The thing that would bother me, was that the Korean overseer we had, would say something over the top, then play the “Im a Korean, I didnt understand what that meant” card.He would often say to me a statement of what he thought a stereotypical ignorant black person might say, assuming I didnt speak proper English. One night he said to me “You don’t wanna be Axin me no questions?” I said in reply, “Im sorry I dont understand you?!” He tried to egg me on and say, “Come on my brutha you know.” I paused and said sternly, “Not all Black people talk that way!”. He then pretended to be apologetic and his accent became conveniently strong. I wasn’t buying it. Also, when he first came, we spent so many fragrances with him asking members, “Are you scared of me?” Members would say, No, but many were intimidated. He would yell, and be rude. He later admitted that he also “wanted to see who would stand up to him”. So the Koreans do have a superiority complex within WMS. Other members with Korean overseers share siNJilar, or more harsh stories.
I live in Korea and my wife is Korean. It's not my intent to be harsh.
Koreans identify nationally as a unit much more than most other peoples. There are many reasons for this, but principally it is a result of being constantly threatened throughout their long history from powerful neighbors on all sides. Except for very recently, they existed on the whim of their more powerful neighbors. Thus, they have sought to draw in on themselves collectively and exclude outsiders historically. Until the last twenty years, western individualism and "free thought" were foreign concepts to most of the population. "Group-think" and a desire to follow a charismatic leader are both very strong urges. This is hard to fathom for westerners, and most Koreans (certainly 2nd and 3rd gen Korean Americans are nothing like Koreans in Korea in this regard) do not realize this is what they are doing.
Additionally, because of their success due to the older generation’s hard work, there is an enormous amount of pride in their recent accomplishments. This new pride is coupled with shame of the Japanese occupation, and recurring domination of China through the centuries. The shame and animosity is real, and is not forgotten. (This is ensured through nationalist-driven interpretations of their history.) Americans do not have long cultural memories, but nations like Korea definitely do. (I'm talking about holding prejudices for several centuries or more) All of this results in a national superiority/inferiority complex, which results in overbearing nationalism, racism, xenophobia. Most Koreans I know consider themselves to be not racist even in the least. Koreans are still new to understanding themselves as a nation on the world scene. It should be remembered that their nickname has been the "hermit kingdom," and they have little understanding of how outsiders see them.
Pride and fear are the powerful mixture that results in the offensive treatment and behavior all of you are describing. Come to Korea for more than brief visit, and you will find yourself squarely confronted with this behavior. However, I would note, that we (Americans) also offend them with our own negative cultural baggage.
Unfortunately, the belief that they are "special" is a real thing. Again, they are far from the only nationality to believe that.
Mr Forster, go on. Tell us more. Tell us more about their social behaviour, their appearances, deception, the asking of something twice, their control, the group mindset.
I do love (btw) the culture actually, the strict social behaviour, the respect, the style, food etc.
@Mike. Glad you saw that my points were aimed at Koreans “within” WMS. I think the issues are only because they have been told they are “Princes from the East” (An Ex Missionary told me that Korean members are told a prophecy about this…but I doubt we will ever see it).
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