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WMS Brother said he couldn't defend because he needs to study more, it does not show that you won by now means. So let's be adult about it instead of taking cheap shots.
Joshua, I understand where you are coming from but let’s face it we are in the end times. Not all are with the God of the Bible. If the Internet existed in the time of Jesus I believe the apostles will still defend their case in a humanly fashion. I just can’t sit around while ignorance rules.
Ignorance is not ruling. Look at the big picture here. Since I started posting here the WMSCOG has claimed to have almost 1.45million members and even as many as 1.8million. Recently I have viewed some post that claim that this group has less than 1.3million members. I know that some people are not going to like this post of mine here but this group is losing members. I even have my doubts that this group even has this many members. People like Rauhl in India, Tim in LA, Diane, and others have been making huge dents in this group. Searching for the truth and bringing the light to those in the dark does not give any of us the right to be offensive. I doubt that jesus and the Apostles would take the actions that some of us and some of the WMSCOG members have taken. Some of the people who are not currently sharing our understanding will not be won over by slighting them. If anything insulting them is causing them to dig in and thus stalling the effort we have in bringing them freedom and the truth. The reason why people like WMSbrother and others have stopped posting has been for two major reasons. 1) They've been attacked or at least feel like they have been. 2) Their truth is not holding up and they are hurting. This is the time for compassion not insults. Please understand where I'm coming from. Use honey not viniger.
The vid of the 15 year member is so true i have seen when ever there is a change of pastor he makes new rules,he changes the full look of the so called zion even the pictures on the wall.They very well know how to side line people if you back answer them or if they get to know anything about you from their leaders they side track you treat you like dirt i known years back they stoped a missionary from praying and presiding and as said they treat you like satan possesed, if some one leaves it is either they are called cheats,no faith,or he loves the world more than god.I am realy happy to see these vid comming up because we realy know it is true and we have seen them (these ex members )in korea and the good talks they gave when they went to korea and belive me ,these are the ones that inspired us years back.regarding breaking famliys i myself heard the pastor tell the group leader to tell a sister to divoce her husband and also lodge a police complaint because he came into the church during the worship and made a big nose the poor man had a valid reason his wife and daughter spent the whole day in zion and wife went on a short term mission to bopal without telling him and when he asked her she refuse to tell him ,what annoyed him was there were men also who went in the group, the sister name is jes.. if not the wmscog members will say it is a lie (mumbai),
Well actually Joshua it is not because our truth does not hold by no means do we feel that way. It's because everyone here has there own opinions, Its like talking about jesus with a Jew, a Greek, a Islamist, a hindu, and a budhist all at once. You cant win all of them with one argument and even you debate amongst yourselves. Very draining.
I can agree with the idea about talking to all of those folks at the same time. Only some of them will see the truth and yes, it can be very draining. As for WMSbrother he admitted that he needed to study more. The truth he has right now he can't seem to defend. He feels unable to fight back and instead of becoming angry like he did before he stopped posting. There is something honorable about part of that. I don't think that fleeing to Zion is a discovery of the truth. The truth can stand up to a up close inspection. If what is being promoted does not hold up then the "truth" of it becomes something other than the truth.
Yes very true, but no everyone will agree with the truth, also, anything can be debated and be made to not "hold up", what I believe what you believe what Genny believes, can all be debated. I'm not trying say something smart, but even what you believe and deem "truth" not everyone here believes. Same goes for me and everyone else here.
The fact that there are so many questionable teachings coming from different WMSCOG members (former and non-former) makes them lose credibility. One zion teaches differently from another zion and even what WMS brother tried to teach here was proven to be different from what other wmscog members claim. E.g about the New Jerusalem book that Ahnsanghong made, WMS brother claims that Ahn did not wrote it while another WMSCOG member blogger defended that the book was wrote by Ahn and even tried to explain the purpose of it. There are so many truths that you don't even know which "truth" WMSCOG claims.
Do you see a problem with this idea? If we all believe like this then the truth is not the truth. The truth can stand up to inspection. The truth can and will stand on its own. If it's not the truth only seems like the truth it will not stand up. Did Jesus dies on the cross? Yes, this is true and can be researched and verified. People have suggested that this event never happened. Their truth falls apart when researched. The truth is the truth. Everything must be tested and held up to the Word of God.
fromtheotherside wrote:
WMS Brother said he couldn't defend because he needs to study more, it does not show that you won by now means. So let's be adult about it instead of taking cheap shots.
Alls he's doing is going back to his handlers and getting the party line on how to answer. So, "fromtheotherside" lets see what you got to say.
The time that the tabernacle (New Jerusalem) see, 9-10) comes down is 1000 years after the end of the world. It is written, “Then I saw‘a new heaven and a new earth,’ for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea.”
Question (from those of us who "need to study more") Has the world ended and if so, has 1000 years passed already ?
Come on, what do you have to say ? BTW these are ASH's words.
I am completely with Joshua on this. We must be gentle and compassionate with each other, trying to understand the other's POV.
Anyway, I think we are getting too much into arguing about less important things. I would like to suggest, if FTOS is willing, that we drop discussions on minor issues (specially those that are mere opinions) and stick to foundational beliefs like the belief in ASH and ZGJ. Would be good to take up one thread for each topic. Genny's questions are a good starting point.
Or we could start with why WMSCOG believes ASH is God in one thread. Another thread why they believe ZGJ is mother god. It would deal with the basic doctrine. It would be great if FTOS can start each of the two threads and give us some knowledge about the fundamental beliefs of the WMSCOG. Then we could respectfully discuss with him about why or with what we agree or disagree. FTOS could even invite WMS brother via PM to come back and join him in the discussion.
As we discuss the main topic, there may be references to Gen 14 and Heb 7 about Melchizedek or Gal 4 which can then be spun off as different threads for discussion. FTOS are you game for it?
Actually Emil, we already tried that. When FTOS first came here we tried to make different forum topics that are related to their teachings. Sad to say, it made him angry and just verbally attacked the people involved in the discussion without really answering the topics at hand. Not saying that we can't try again. You can try it too but we really should discourage insulting words which is not helpful to the discussion.
Elie I was never angry. When I'm angry I get physical, so I don't allow myself to get angry even on the interent, it's more annoyed. Also you were not very 'careful' with your words either. Your comment is the exact reason I get annoyed, always one sided.
Okay, then let's have a truce. We will have a simple discussion. No insulting, no cussing, no saying of things that is very offensive, let's just have a simple exchange of ideas and opinion. Deal?
Okay great between you and me.
Wow, ok, I'm starting to get a little excited and hopeful here. We all know that this could work.
fromtheotherside wrote:
Elie I was never angry. When I'm angry I get physical, so I don't allow myself to get angry even on the interent, it's more annoyed. Also you were not very 'careful' with your words either. Your comment is the exact reason I get annoyed, always one sided.
Why did you ignore Jesus's question ? Thank you Jesus ! Great question Sir ! Physical ? You get physical ? LMAO. I'm hiding behind my couch as I type this. [removed for rules] Deal me out of that Peace Treaty. [removed for rules] I may consider coming back to the table for peace negotiations. Physical. LOL. [removed for rules]
Wake up
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKvufIkWrBkfromtheotherside wrote:
Elie I was never angry. When I'm angry I get physical, so I don't allow myself to get angry even on the interent, it's more annoyed. Also you were not very 'careful' with your words either. Your comment is the exact reason I get annoyed, always one sided.
Why did you ignore Jesus's question ? Thank you Jesus ! Great question Sir ! Physical ? You get physical ? LMAO. I'm hiding behind my couch as I type this. [removed for rules] Deal me out of that Peace Treaty. [removed for rules] I may consider coming back to the table for peace negotiations. Physical. LOL. [removed for rules]
Wake up
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKvufIkWrBkSome comic relief going on here.
Some comic relief going on here.
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