[emil]

The WMSCOG makes a big deal out of two things; keeping the Sabbath and celebrating the Passover. For both things, I understand they teach that the catholic church abolished them in the 4th century.

I am starting this thread to discuss the issue of the issue of the Passover and about when and how it was abolished by the catholic church. I request wmscog members and former members to weigh in.

I am not clear about what the passover is as celebrated by the wmscog. What aspect of it was abolished in the 4th century.

[Simon]

[Simon]

Keeping the 14th of nisan (properly abib) rather than easter is heresy. by the council of nicea but easter didn’t just poof in at nicea as tmyou and i have discussed re polycarp

[emil]

Good. Now is that the only issue they have about Passover (the date), or is there something about the way it is celebrated also?

FTOS – do you agree with Simon on the date of the passover? 14th of Nisan or is it Abib? According to wmscog, when did this happen?

[Simon]

I don’t know how the liturgy compares other than timing

[Anonymous]

Hal, that interpretation of Our Lords words are borderline sacrilegious even if you don’t believe in the real presence. However the real presence was intended by Christ. It is clear from John 6 and the testimony of early Christians that nobody believed it was a mere symbol. Even the use of the greek word anemnesis for remembrance show a deeper significance of his action being a true sacrifice.

I’m still commenting via iPhone so I’ll just post two links.

The Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist

http://www.learn-the-faith.com/archives/the-mass-is-a-sacrafice/

[Anonymous]

Hal, I really wish I was at a regular computer right now, but ill say this. If you don’t accept Christ as messiah, I don’t think you’re going to be able to actually contribute to this thread. Why bother commenting on what Christ intended at Passover if you reject Christ?

[Simon]

Actually four months have names given:  Aviv (first)  Bul (second) Eisanim (seventh) and Ziv (eighth)

[emil]

Does FTOS have nothing to add to this most important topic of the wmscog?

[emil]

Thanks Hal, Simon. When the WMSCOG specify the date, how do they do it? Do they say the name or number of the month? Wish we could have FTOS' input here.

[Simon]

at the feasts themselves they only use numbers but in books of "truth" they use the babylonian names

[emil]

Ah OK. If they do use the babylonian names for the months of their feasts, then they are living in glass houses and shouldn't throw stones at others. Other members on this forum, I hope you guys know that the names of the months of the Jewish calendar are of babylonian origin.

[Sarah2013]

I did not know that, Emil.

[emil]

^ The Jewish calendar only used month numbers until their Babylonian exile/captivity. After returning from exile, they began using the names of the months which the Babylonians used. I don't see anything wrong with that. However, when the wmscog points fingers at others by claiming pagan origins, this should have been a big no-no for them.

[Simon]

emil wrote:

^ The Jewish calendar only used month numbers until their Babylonian exile/captivity.After returning from exile, they began using the names of the months which the Babylonians used. I don't see anything wrong with that. However, when the wmscog points fingers at others by claiming pagan origins, this should have been a big no-no for them.

Technically for clarification, that isn't 100% true, most of the original names are lost we know four of the names as I stated before. 

 

Simon wrote:

Actually four months have names given:  Aviv (first)  Bul (second) Eisanim (seventh) and Ziv (eighth)

 

[fromtheotherside]

emil wrote:

^ The Jewish calendar only used month numbers until their Babylonian exile/captivity. After returning from exile, they began using the names of the months which the Babylonians used. I don't see anything wrong with that. However, when the wmscog points fingers at others by claiming pagan origins, this should have been a big no-no for them.

Emil you still don't understand.  By your understanding we should not speak, wear clothes or even move, but just stand there naked until we die. Lolz!    Because the english language is Pagan, Jeans are pagan and so are suits, but that would be rediculous wouldn't it.  You still haven't  grasped why we consider Christmas pagan and a nono, even though I've explained it multiple times.  The difference between Christmas and names of Months and "sandwiches" is that they are not celebrations or used in worship of God.  No wonder you can't see what the point is.  Everyone else understands except you.

[Stained]

Simon wrote:

emil wrote:

^ The Jewish calendar only used month numbers until their Babylonian exile/captivity.After returning from exile, they began using the names of the months which the Babylonians used. I don't see anything wrong with that. However, when the wmscog points fingers at others by claiming pagan origins, this should have been a big no-no for them.

Technically for clarification, that isn't 100% true, most of the original names are lost we know four of the names as I stated before. 

 

Simon wrote:

Actually four months have names given:  Aviv (first)  Bul (second) Eisanim (seventh) and Ziv (eighth)

 Acutally. LMAO.

[emil]

fromtheotherside wrote:

 

Emil you still don't understand.  By your understanding we should not speak, wear clothes or even move, but just stand there naked until we die. Lolz!    Because the english language is Pagan, Jeans are pagan and so are suits, but that would be rediculous wouldn't it.  You still haven't  grasped why we consider Christmas pagan and a nono, even though I've explained it multiple times.  The difference between Christmas and names of Months and "sandwiches" is that they are not celebrations or used in worship of God.  No wonder you can't see what the point is.  Everyone else understands except you.

Sorry friend, you've got the wrong number. Read again what I have written. "I don't see anything wrong with that". I guess everyone else here understood what that meant.

Regarding the Christmas discussion, why don't we have it in the right thread? The one where you have not been able to back up your claim that the very word "christmas" is pagan?

In this thread you can tell us all about when Satan abolished the Passover if that is what you believe.

[Simon]

It appears under further research that other than abib they may be phoenecian not sure

[emil]

fromtheotherside wrote:

 

Emil you still don't understand.  By your understanding we should not speak, wear clothes or even move, but just stand there naked until we die. Lolz!    Because the english language is Pagan, Jeans are pagan and so are suits, but that would be rediculous wouldn't it.  You still haven't  grasped why we consider Christmas pagan and a nono, even though I've explained it multiple times.  The difference between Christmas and names of Months and "sandwiches" is that they are not celebrations or used in worship of God.  No wonder you can't see what the point is.  Everyone else understands except you.

OK so you do not use the names of the months to define when you are to worship your god? But you do say that you celebrate passover on the 14th of Nisan right?

Now I choose to celebrate the birthday of my Lord on 25th December. Why exactly is that pagan? Pagans would have had something bad they did on possibly every single day of the year, given that pagan history is thousands of years old. How can you ensure that pagans did not have some kind of feast on the day you celebrate your feast? You simply cannot.

God knows my heart. He knows whom I am worshiping every single day including Christmas Day. He also knows who you have been worshiping.

Now lets get back to the passover.

[emil]

Simon wrote:

It appears under further research that other than abib they may be phoenecian not sure

That would probably make it worse. Since the wmscog says the King of Tyre was satan, it means the name of the month came straight from satan.

[Simon]

Not the ones they use bul eisanim and ziv but that opens other questions but doesn’t change the contradictions on wmscogs part