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As a member I was taught that our tithes & offerings go to the “True God” in the order of Melchizedek. We keep the New Covenant Passover and in return give a tenth of everything to God. Now I was told all the money goes to Korea and “mother” determines how the money is spent, as she is god on earth. Now I’m hearing the church is distancing themselves from Korea saying they’re not affiliated with the WMSCOG headquarters in Korea. I wanted to confirm this before I made this post. I found the exact information in the lawsuit WMSCOG and Mark Ortiz against Michele Colon and Tyler Newton. Lines 34 and 35 state this church is an independent entity, legally and functionally.
If that is so, where the heck did my tithes and offerings go? In case you can’t tell I’m angry as heck! I never questioned this while I was a member because since they told me the money goes to Korea why would I think my “church” would lie to me. But why do we defer to Korea headquarters for so many things then if the churches are independent entities? You can’t have your cake and eat it too. Either you are separate or not. I have not seen or heard of any financial transparency so the question remains….where do the tithes and offerings go?
Where do the tithes and offerings go?
Anyone have a valid answer? Where do the tithes and offerings go?
another question when people tithe should it not be per family, If husband & wife = one why do they both need to tithe, and why do children tithe,(someone mentioned children tithing and something about a brown envelope special offering??) is it not enough with the parents income???
tithing per family would equal the same amount as per person and per person makes more sense for a lot of reasons
If a child does not have income, what do they tithe on? And if there is only one paycheck coming in for the family, would they still expect separate tithes for husband and wife?
Where the money goes, according to that particular tax form (http://www2.guidestar.org/FinDocuments/2008/364/367/2008-364367423-04e2556a-9.pdf) for that particular location, "Functional Expenses" Part IX:
Legal $60
Office Expenses $6936
Occupancy (mortgage payments?) $23,000
Travel $4099
Conferences, conventions, and meetings $7766
Interest (from mortgage?) $45,290
Depreciation, deprecation, amortization $28,336
Missionary $328,843
Utilities $39,670
Insurance $8787
Repairs and maintenance $43,835
Supplies $4933
Licenses, Bank charges $2228
Total functional expenses $543,783
Sounds like a lot, but don't forget their stated income from member contributions was $766,432, plus they got interest income of $1123 and "funds from parental church" of $26,654.
Just from that, we can see there was a positive cash flow of more than $200,000.
I will echo your question, Disturbed. Where does that money go? What did they do with that $200,000? With a surplus like that, I'd sure hope this location was not asking for donations of coffee and toilet paper and soap, etc.
It's very rare for people not to have increase
Simon wrote:
Sounds like youre describing a franchise I know it can be done for profit never heard of it with non profits maybe
If they get funds from a parental church, then why do they deny that they have a relationship to other entities on their application for tax exempt status? Very inconsistent. See here. Page 3, question 5. They even deny that they are financially accountable to any other organization in question 7, yet when I was a member I was told that all of the money got sent to S. Korea.
your asking the wrong person emily
Disturbed wrote:
@Genny…every Zion I have been to all things are provided by the members (hand soap, cleaning supplies, toilet paper, paper towels, food, plates, everything). That's why I'm questioning where the money is going. Besides the mortgage/rent and utilities the church isn't putting out for anything.Alter flower arrangements, choir robes…nothing is done/provided by the church.
Every member has to tithe. Even college students whose only income is from their parents are expected to tithe.
I know my zion paid for a lot of stuff itself (not everything of course)
Has anyone ever noted that the Bigshine Worldwide Inc. logo is on the pastor's emails in their Zion? That was recently noticed by someone at the Zion in Chicago.
I never seen Emails from Pastor but then there is no big shine near my (former) pastor so far as I can find either
And I am wondering how the Zion in Bloomingdale had so much in contributions. I attended there a couple times in 2009 and it was a small church sanctuary without a whole lot of people. I would estimate there wasn't over 80 at the time. Maybe a few more or less because I didn't count, but it wasn't big enough to have that much in contributions in my opinion. Interestiing.
They were mostly donated where I went. From chairs to toiletries, to food, you name it. In fact, there isn't anything wrong with such. My bone of contention is its leadership and what it is portrayed to be is different from what it really is. If members contribute most of the supplies then this means tithes/offerings and monatary donations only takes care of fixed expenses like rent and bills. What happens to the rest? So Disturbed's question is so freaking valid – "where do the tithes & offerings go?"
80 people over the course of a year. Tithes, and Two offerings every week, offerings on each service of each of the seven feasts, buying books of "truth" and "new song" books "evidence" books "new song" CDs Elohist magazines random free will offerings when "mother asks" it adds up
That is bills, isn't it? Are you telling me those wipe them out? If that be the case, friend, they will not have anything close to what they have set up in Korea. Come on…
True. I don't doubt they have a lot of money. I really doubt that the pastors let the congregation know how much though, or they wouldn't be able to go to them for more and more. I think the real revenue is downplayed and the congregation is completely in the dark on that.
Do you realize the type of money some members have given to this church? Are you kidding me????
Sarah2013 wrote:
They were mostly donated where I went. From chairs to toiletries, to food, you name it. In fact, there isn't anything wrong with such. My bone of contention is its leadership and what it is portrayed to be is different from what it really is. If members contribute most of the supplies then this means tithes/offerings and monatary donations only takes care of fixed expenses like rent and bills. What happens to the rest? So Disturbed's question is so freaking valid – "where do the tithes & offerings go?"
Sarah from what I was told, it is the members that pay for "EVERYTHING' aside from the tithe, most members give monthly contribution for food & rent.
All the food is paid for by the members of the kitchen committee, but they ask others for 45 or more a month for food. there is a flower committee, bathroom committee, everything has a committe. Sounds fair, everyone should help out.
The rent is split between 100 people or more at about 50 or more a month per person.(they already know how much you make) They say the tithe & offering is not enough to pay the rent, the rent is too high and they need extra help. (My friends zion is like that.)
t-shirts are sold at 18 bucks, and the color changes from yellow to green, to whatever color $$ when ever an event is coming up. so if you already own a yellow wms shirt, you might need to purchase a new one for 18 bucks because they want to change the color.
I even heared they sell scarfs (see the times square video, everyone is wearing a yellow scarf)
they said in one video that Steve Hassan just wanted to promote his book, freedom of mind but look at all the things my friend told me they(members) have to pay for.
the viels are 8 bucks (sisters only)
song books are 10 bucks
evidence book 12-14 bucks
preaching cards are 5/10 cards (for you to write your name and number and give it out) for a 1 buck
Ahn's/pastors/mothers books range from 3-12 bucks
the cartoon magazine is like 18 a month…God's word is put in a comic book, how silly is that.
the elohist magazine is like 40 a year….not sure..
music cd's are like 5 bucks or more
the soap, papertowel, plates, cups, spoons are bought by the members,
the toilet paper used to wipe their B%^* is bought by members
donations are collected for appliances & furniture
food, coffee, water, etc.
if there is a event and you volunteer you have to give money for the flyers, signs, markers, etc.
I don't know about the choir?????
I heared from here they were collecting to buy preaching vans???
everything cost you money in zion, nothing is free!
I hope pints of blood is not being sold (I'm kidding)
and I heared you don't even get a free pen! Oh once they gave a calendar, but then asked everyone to bring it back, that it was to be recycled.
when they go preaching by car, who pays for the gas, the parking at the malls, NOT THEM.
so what are the tithe & offering for……."a rainy day"
why if i did not have to pay for nothing and have people work for me for free(what is your talent) and give me stuff,(supplies & donations) then i could surely own a biz, and make mo money, mo money.
America, the land of opportunity, where all your dreams come true!
In my humble opinion 🙂
PS DID I MISS ANYTHING? ANYONE KNOW OF SOMETHING ELSE.
Just look at that! This was my point also, which is why Disturbed's comment was valid. If members are doing all of this then where is the real money going? Ahhh…. What a shame. My people perish for lack of knowledge, says the Lord.
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