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This video was sent to me recently.
Great video,Really nice to see them being exposed with their bible verses.
This really is a good video. I am so happy to see this and I agree that we have to be prepared to answer. I especially liked the part where he says "don't chase the rabbits" when they try to get you on the subject of veils or other non-important topics. Stay on the points that matter: "Who is God and can He save you?" Otherwise, they make your head spin, really, with all the non vital points they bring up.
Quin's effort is truly commendable. However, MANY of the arguements presented in the first thirty minutes of this video would be refuted by an experienced gospel worker from the WMSCOG. I say this because when I was a member, we were trained on how to respond when people presented such arguements. I often times feel that a secondary (or perhaps even a primary ) purpose for the cult members preaching is not only to bring in new members but also to brain wash the individual even further. This video does a good job of showing traditional biblical doctine and juxtaposing it the the WMSCOG doctrine but as for the person trapped in the cult, they can teach and justify their belief from several different angles, using several different analogies with many different verses. My theory is that the only way to diminish the hold of the WMSCOG is to not use some other belief or doctrine in a vain attempt at refutation because that simply wont work, but rather to dig in to the teachings, put them under heavy scrutiny and find the contradiction, the non sequitur, the fallacy through history, etymology and pragmatism. And thats exactly what i'm setting out to do today.
@Brian Taylor: There is the old adage "If you really want to learn something, teach it." So I agree with your point that the members are actually more and more brainwashed as they teach and preach the doctrine. It really works out for the WMS that way, for sure, and in order to teach it, they have to spend hours, weeks, months, etc., learning it well enough to preach. Double edged sword.
I think that Quin's effort is especially good, though, for warning those not yet involved with the WMS. It is encouraging that so many people are now concerned enough to begin spreading the word about what this group is all about. And he does it in a really good way, not trying to offend the member who is trying to preach while still resisting the doctrine presented. I like that. And really looking at the main points and verses he talks of also help a person learn the Bible verses that prove our point, so it is kind of like our own "double edged sword." It can't be bad.
I love your videos, Brian, and I look forward to your next one! Keep up the good work. Everyone's efforts are helping tremendously.
Sorry Buyfutcoins I wasn't done watching this video you buried
This is a great video! He make many vaild points.
Good one. Someone commented on the no cross issue at their sanctuary. This is a very strong debate for me.
Excellent video, thanks for sharing this.
However we also need to note that the wmscog teaches that "nobody can interpret the scripture except for root of david", citing revelation chapter 5 and claiming that the whole bible has been sealed, and nobody could read it. While this may not make sense to outsiders, some who are inside the wmscog truly believes it.
For those trying to get their loved ones or friends out the group, we need to not just present sound doctrines, but to question them from their angles. Let me share about my own experience:
Only Root of David can interpret the Bible so we must identify Root of David: ASH fulfilled prophecies concerning the Root of David so we must listen to his teachings
So what prophecies did he fulfill?
ASH fulfilled the prophecy of being baptised at 30 years old and preaching the gospel for 37 years
Did he really? -present evidences that actually he did not-
Those stuff you showed are fabricated! They are made by the devil to trick us! Be careful!
What about the evidences of failed prophecies, lawsuits, changed teachings? -present evidence-
Those are fake as well!
Then is there anything objective and concrete that I can see as evidence?
Actually there is, the most clear sign is that he brought back the passover,which we must keep in order to be saved. Also, we must not judge based on physical things!
What about the seals in revelation chapter 10? It was taught that sixth seal refers to WWII, but there were already saints when seal 5 was opened? How can there be saints who follow God if nobody was keeping the passover before 1948?
That's because the seals are not in that listed order, God sealed up the Bible, remember? God purposelly wrote it in a different sequence so that only his true children, those who are in zion, can know about the truth.
Was there a difference in dates for OT passover and NT passover?
Absolutely not. Passover must be kept on the 14th day of the month of Nisan. In fact not a single feast of God was changed in the date, only the ceremony was changed. Woe to those who claim that the feasts are abolished or keeping the feasts on the wrong dates! (communion vs passover)
But the wmscog actually keeps the feasts on different dates then the jewish people! I understand that babylon and satan are actually tricking us, but this is an objective date from the jews, who have no link to christianity. -presents evidence-
If the jews were wrong, what about NASA? If we find information from NASA regarding the lunar movements we can also see that wmscog is keeping it on a different date -presents evidence-
Other Christians are wrong, the Jews are wrong, NASA is wrong, Scripture is wrong because it has been sealed, secualr evidences are wrong because they are fake, only we are correct! Thanks to Father and Mother!
….I think I am out of here =)
Great video for those who are on the outside and preparing people to be on the defense…but with their thick inpentrable mindwash this video alone may not be enough
Kai TIng wrote:
Excellent video, thanks for sharing this.
However we also need to note that the wmscog teaches that "nobody can interpret the scripture except for root of david", citing revelation chapter 5 and claiming that the whole bible has been sealed, and nobody could read it. While this may not make sense to outsiders, some who are inside the wmscog truly believes it.
For those trying to get their loved ones or friends out the group, we need to not just present sound doctrines, but to question them from their angles. Let me share about my own experience:
Only Root of David can interpret the Bible so we must identify Root of David: ASH fulfilled prophecies concerning the Root of David so we must listen to his teachings
So what prophecies did he fulfill?
ASH fulfilled the prophecy of being baptised at 30 years old and preaching the gospel for 37 years
Did he really? -present evidences that actually he did not-
Those stuff you showed are fabricated! They are made by the devil to trick us! Be careful!
What about the evidences of failed prophecies, lawsuits, changed teachings? -present evidence-
Those are fake as well!
Then is there anything objective and concrete that I can see as evidence?
Actually there is, the most clear sign is that he brought back the passover,which we must keep in order to be saved. Also, we must not judge based on physical things!
What about the seals in revelation chapter 10? It was taught that sixth seal refers to WWII, but there were already saints when seal 5 was opened? How can there be saints who follow God if nobody was keeping the passover before 1948?
That's because the seals are not in that listed order, God sealed up the Bible, remember? God purposelly wrote it in a different sequence so that only his true children, those who are in zion, can know about the truth.
Was there a difference in dates for OT passover and NT passover?
Absolutely not. Passover must be kept on the 14th day of the month of Nisan. In fact not a single feast of God was changed in the date, only the ceremony was changed. Woe to those who claim that the feasts are abolished or keeping the feasts on the wrong dates! (communion vs passover)
But the wmscog actually keeps the feasts on different dates then the jewish people! I understand that babylon and satan are actually tricking us, but this is an objective date from the jews, who have no link to christianity. -presents evidence-
If the jews were wrong, what about NASA? If we find information from NASA regarding the lunar movements we can also see that wmscog is keeping it on a different date -presents evidence-
Other Christians are wrong, the Jews are wrong, NASA is wrong, Scripture is wrong because it has been sealed, secualr evidences are wrong because they are fake, only we are correct! Thanks to Father and Mother!
….I think I am out of here =)
Great video for those who are on the outside and preparing people to be on the defense…but with their thick inpentrable mindwash this video alone may not be enough
You're right! You sound just like them. I remember when i went there once to visit they were saying all of that.
Felicia1122 wrote:
Kai TIng wrote:
Excellent video, thanks for sharing this.
However we also need to note that the wmscog teaches that "nobody can interpret the scripture except for root of david", citing revelation chapter 5 and claiming that the whole bible has been sealed, and nobody could read it. While this may not make sense to outsiders, some who are inside the wmscog truly believes it.
For those trying to get their loved ones or friends out the group, we need to not just present sound doctrines, but to question them from their angles. Let me share about my own experience:
Only Root of David can interpret the Bible so we must identify Root of David: ASH fulfilled prophecies concerning the Root of David so we must listen to his teachings
So what prophecies did he fulfill?
ASH fulfilled the prophecy of being baptised at 30 years old and preaching the gospel for 37 years
Did he really? -present evidences that actually he did not-
Those stuff you showed are fabricated! They are made by the devil to trick us! Be careful!
What about the evidences of failed prophecies, lawsuits, changed teachings? -present evidence-
Those are fake as well!
Then is there anything objective and concrete that I can see as evidence?
Actually there is, the most clear sign is that he brought back the passover,which we must keep in order to be saved. Also, we must not judge based on physical things!
What about the seals in revelation chapter 10? It was taught that sixth seal refers to WWII, but there were already saints when seal 5 was opened? How can there be saints who follow God if nobody was keeping the passover before 1948?
That's because the seals are not in that listed order, God sealed up the Bible, remember? God purposelly wrote it in a different sequence so that only his true children, those who are in zion, can know about the truth.
Was there a difference in dates for OT passover and NT passover?
Absolutely not. Passover must be kept on the 14th day of the month of Nisan. In fact not a single feast of God was changed in the date, only the ceremony was changed. Woe to those who claim that the feasts are abolished or keeping the feasts on the wrong dates! (communion vs passover)
But the wmscog actually keeps the feasts on different dates then the jewish people! I understand that babylon and satan are actually tricking us, but this is an objective date from the jews, who have no link to christianity. -presents evidence-
If the jews were wrong, what about NASA? If we find information from NASA regarding the lunar movements we can also see that wmscog is keeping it on a different date -presents evidence-
Other Christians are wrong, the Jews are wrong, NASA is wrong, Scripture is wrong because it has been sealed, secualr evidences are wrong because they are fake, only we are correct! Thanks to Father and Mother!
….I think I am out of here =)
Great video for those who are on the outside and preparing people to be on the defense…but with their thick inpentrable mindwash this video alone may not be enough
You're right! You sound just like them. I remember when i went there once to visit they were saying all of that.
Well as a fresh ex-member I am still quite aware what tactics they use haha =) If someone does not go in and get involved with these people it's quite hard to know about it's inner workings
@Kai: You are right about that. Hard to know unless you go in and get involved. But there are so many corroborating stories from ex members that it isn't hard to get a general idea. I value your input quite a bit because of the fact that they morph so well, and you have a very fresh perspective that would address any recent changes. Thanks for that.
Wow …
@Jellybean: Were you referring to my post? I hope I didn't make something unclear. That happens sometimes with the written word. I was just saying that it is good to hear from people who are just out because I want to keep up on any new changes in their doctrine. It was interesting in some other posts that they are changing the new songs in a way that seems to talk about the imminent passing of "Mother" and how Ahnsahnghong is going to come and take her up to heaven before the very eyes of the members. Never heard that one before.
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