- Topic
is the topic of my newest wmscog video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbL-1Vyso2Y
Brian excellent vedio,It is very similar to the system followed here in mumbai India,they have bible study on wednesday ,where the pastor teaches a subject from the preaching book . Then on the sabbath day they tell the ones who attended or the large group leader to preach the subject to the group and see that the signatures are taken from other members they have preach to, there are five blocks for signature but the last one is for the pastor to listen and sign.Once in two months they have members from different zions come and gather in the head church and all the leaders and pastors too, they mix all the members and conduct a exam and marks are given at times also gifts are given( bibles , truth books,cds etc).If it is a small house church which is just established the pastor and his wife will go to the house and teach the family a subject and tell them they want to hear their preaching the next time they vist their house, in this process too there is a lot of love bombing they will take fruits etc and go and visit the members and praise members and tell them to come for the third day worship or sabbath day worship also give members latest news from korea and what mother has said, if members give them some sad story they will tell them we are in the last days and the kingdom of heaven is very near and we must have patients and endure like mother and father. If they like a youth member and he is fit for gospel work at once they will make her/ him a small group leader and teach him the study of obedience eg : will be the cheif pastor how did father make him even though there were many elders with father but choose him because he was obient and listened and ready to do anything father told him.even though the elders spoke and complained behind fathers back he was faithful to father and listened. I also seen them share the frangrance of zion in the groups where members share how father and mother helped them this week no worldly talk.Here i noticed one thing is we get to know what going on in members life and the leaders carry the news to the pastors.Even if the husband is harrasing his wife or children or drinking problems etc , members tell the leaders and this info is passed to the pastors wife and she will tell the pastor then pastor will pass the info to male group leader and ask him why he doesnt know about it and he needs to take care of the flock.They also force leaders to encourage members to buy truth books song books ,elohist ,cds and they keep a record of which member brought what.The pastor makes it a pont to go with the large group leader to the group members house and ask each member how are you etc if the member has paid less tithes why what is the problem .If a sister pays less thites at once he will ask is a salary so less please preach tithes again to them in front of me when we visit them.Basicly i noticed they have kept members busy for the whole week from saturday (sabbath),sunday bible study and preaching meeting for working members,monday preaching meeting,tuesday 3rd day worship,wednesday bible study,group leaders meeting,friday zion cleaning plus visting members to bring them for sabbath and for leaders to keep track of their attendance and tithes.After the sabbath worship in the night last worship all group leaders meet in a room and disscus about their attendence and tithes how the group has progressed and how did father and mother help them to do their best.The groups who have not done well in turns will explain why and what steps they have taken to solve their problems.There is a bunch of members who go daily preaching in the morning at 10-30 and evening at 4-30 leaving tuesday and saturday.So Brian you are right in everything you said it is true brain washing because i have seen members trying to be better then one another and want to be praised by their leaders and pastor.
Abhigail Delema wrote:
… latest news from korea and what mother has said, if members give them some sad story they will tell them we are in the last days and the kingdom of heaven is very near and we must have patients and endure like mother and father…
I for one do not under stand why should the members be patient and have to endure anything at all if the end is so close?
..If they like a youth member and he is fit for gospel work at once they will make her/ him a small group leader and teach him the study of obedience eg : will be the cheif pastor how did father make him even though there were many elders with father but choose him because he was obient and listened and ready to do anything father told him.even though the elders spoke and complained behind fathers back he was faithful to father and listened…
How about the fact that young children are more impressionable and easier to control than adults? And in all honesty this sounds more like a long term growth strategy of picking children because they need them to spend their youth growing the cult. If they were picking anyone of any age then that might be evidence that what they preach, especially their emphasis on how close the end is, might be authentic. However tactitcs such as this further demonstrate that it's a scam.
…I also seen them share the frangrance of zion in the groups where members share how father and mother helped them this week no worldly talk.Here i noticed one thing is we get to know what going on in members life and the leaders carry the news to the pastors.Even if the husband is harrasing his wife or children or drinking problems etc , members tell the leaders and this info is passed to the pastors wife and she will tell the pastor then pastor will p*** the info to male group leader and ask him why he doesnt know about it and he needs to take care of the flock…
That is just sickening! These people are really insidious and evil. Again they're playing a very dangerous game of puppet master by trying to control their members. And the worst about it is that the people doing all this is are themselves good people, their intention comes from a desire to do good. But they have fallen into an evil of the worst kind: the one that destroys you by making you believe that you're actually doing good.
If only that red heifer could be consumed by actual flames. Yes I said it.
Brian Taylor wrote:
is the topic of my newest wmscog video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbL-1Vyso2Y
Love the video.
I have never really thought about it until you mentioned how the repition of the doctrine is actually brainwashing.
But knowing how sophisticated this cult is, they would throw out a line from the bible that says, "faith comes from hearing the message." And the member would again silence dissonance. As long as the member has the belief that since it came from the bible it's true and that whatever the cult shows them from the bible is the "true" interpretation then it's very difficult to see this organisation for what it is.
Brian Taylor wrote:
…. Suppression of all outside information is the second half. I wonder what scripture they would show to justify that?
The whole "US" versus "THEM" mentality. Darkness vs the light, good vs evil, god vs satan…
I'm sure there are scriptures aplenty about how zion is god's dwelling place and so on…
So any information outside of zion is of the devil
I guess the scripture they would show to justify Suppression of outside info is like 2 Tim 2 :4 also 14-18 23-26 Ch 2 Tim 3; 1-9 verse 10 -16 will give members hope what they see and hear on the inter-net is all false and they have to go true all this percecution. Next would be continue preaching dont stop 2 Tim 4; 1-4 verse 7 says you will be rewared with the crown ,verse 9 says ignore the people who love the world. Also 1 Tim 4 11 -14 . Titus 3 1-11. verse 9 is a warning to brothers and sisters. Psalm 49 : 20 atleast i was thought these verses about the outside information ,but staying there i realized they dont practise what they preach and we are totally filled with the thought Darkness vs the light, good vs evil, god vs satan etc.A real big brain wash.
Brian, your video could be my son talking. His story seems eerily similar. He has been in for 7 years now. How will he go on in the aftermath of realizing he was lied to and manipulated for all that time? How will he reconcile the damage done to him in his finances, career, relationships, and the loss of living freely all that time? We love him, and we will be here for him when he makes his decision. We will not say "I told you so," or allow anyone else to criticise him either. We will protect him and try to help him heal. It is going to be a long hard journey for him to recover. But he has us.
Thank you so much for the bravery it took for you to speak out. It shows both courage and cariing for others. You could have just gone on and tried to put your own life back together, but you went out on a limb to help others who are recovering. I hope others take your lead in making videos about their experiences in the wms.
Brian Taylor wrote:
Azula wrote:
Brian Taylor wrote:
…. Suppression of all outside information is the second half. I wonder what scripture they would show to justify that?
The whole "US" versus "THEM" mentality. Darkness vs the light, good vs evil, god vs satan…
I'm sure there are scriptures aplenty about how zion is god's dwelling place and so on…
So any information outside of zion is of the devil
… Let me reiterate by saying that it all boils down to the prophecies. …
I get that and you are right this is their main hook. I can actually remember the rhetoric about, "Who fulfil the prophecies 100%? Only c-ash." or "only cog fulfil all the prophecies" and so on…
But what I failed to realise then was that this was all nonsense. Anyone can take one word here and another there in the bible and make up some would be "prophecy" about how god should have been born in Timbuktu. As long as folks believe that the bible is absolute then the cults such as this one will always exist.
Brian Taylor wrote:
MountainMom wrote:
Brian, your video could be my son talking. His story seems eerily similar. He has been in for 7 years now. How will he go on in the aftermath of realizing he was lied to and manipulated for all that time? How will he reconcile the damage done to him in his finances, career, relationships, and the loss of living freely all that time? We love him, and we will be here for him when he makes his decision. We will not say "I told you so," or allow anyone else to criticise him either. We will protect him and try to help him heal. It is going to be a long hard journey for him to recover. But he has us.
Thank you so much for the bravery it took for you to speak out. It shows both courage and cariing for others. You could have just gone on and tried to put your own life back together, but you went out on a limb to help others who are recovering. I hope others take your lead in making videos about their experiences in the wms.
I again thank you for the kind words and support. The more and more I study and dig into the WMSCOG and their inner workings the more I feel that they will come to and end and some point, Or atleast continue recycling out older members ( Your son) and replacing them with new, young, gullible and credulou s members. They can only rationalize so many lies, scandals and failed doomsday perdictions before they need to get rid of the people who have been there for so long.
"Recycling old members for new members" that is something I have been researching along with "average length of time as member"
I think it's widely accepted theory that, "no one stays in a cult forever" Does anyone have any data regarding the average length of stay?
For some reason it seems 7 years, for the most part, is the maximum length of membership. (for this particular group)
I'm sure there are people who have stayed longer but I have not been able to find very many of them.
I would really appreciate any info I can get regarding this
David wrote:
Brian Taylor wrote:
MountainMom wrote:
Brian, your video could be my son talking. His story seems eerily similar. He has been in for 7 years now. How will he go on in the aftermath of realizing he was lied to and manipulated for all that time? How will he reconcile the damage done to him in his finances, career, relationships, and the loss of living freely all that time? We love him, and we will be here for him when he makes his decision. We will not say "I told you so," or allow anyone else to criticise him either. We will protect him and try to help him heal. It is going to be a long hard journey for him to recover. But he has us.
Thank you so much for the bravery it took for you to speak out. It shows both courage and cariing for others. You could have just gone on and tried to put your own life back together, but you went out on a limb to help others who are recovering. I hope others take your lead in making videos about their experiences in the wms.
I again thank you for the kind words and support. The more and more I study and dig into the WMSCOG and their inner workings the more I feel that they will come to and end and some point, Or atleast continue recycling out older members ( Your son) and replacing them with new, young, gullible and credulou s members. They can only rationalize so many lies, scandals and failed doomsday perdictions before they need to get rid of the people who have been there for so long.
"Recycling old members for new members" that is something I have been researching along with "average length of time as member"
I think it's widely accepted theory that, "no one stays in a cult forever" Does anyone have any data regarding the average length of stay?
For some reason it seems 7 years, for the most part, is the maximum length of membership. (for this particular group)
I'm sure there are people who have stayed longer but I have not been able to find very many of them.
I would really appreciate any info I can get regarding this
I knew members who were in over 10 years, and they didn't hold a title i.e. (deacon, deaconess, missionary)
As far as recycling is concerned they would move different members to other "zions" to give the appearance of new brothers and sisters, for any new members to see. On Sabbaths, you would see alot of new faces but they would be visiting from neighboring COGs.
I also can say alot of members seem to age out (mature and open their eyes to the bs), and are replaced by overseas members.
When a member who had been "firm in faith" would suddenly dissapear, I was always told some outlandish story, that they died, or went to Satan, or moved out of the country. They would never be spoken of again, like they never even existed. Huge red flag.
Brian,
Taking repetition out of the equation, how does one take on an idea from this group and make it their own? i.e., take on the ideology of the group?
Thank you,
Jorge
I recently had a conversation with my love one, and I was telling her, how much I miss all the times we used to spent together and all the things we used to do, for sometime i felt that she still wanted to keep things the same way, but as time went on and as she realized that i was always rejecting coming to her church and accepting this father and mother thing, that's when she started falling apart from me.
I finally told her to tell me the truth and be honest with me, …. So she said that it's not that she doesn't wanna spent time with me or keep me away, it's just that i'm not at the same spiritual level she is (according to her) and that activities or people outside the church were just a distraction that kept her from following the truth and as long as she was in the truth things between me and her were never going to be the same.
I understood right and there how BRAINWASHED, she really is, and that's exactly why members of this group tend to steer away from family or friends who wont accept their newly acquired believes. for quite some time i was attending this place for studies just so i could have some quality time with her (IF YOU CAN CALL THAT QUALITY TIME) but i was growing upset by the pressure this group and my love one was always putting up in me by wanting me to get baptized.
Jesus_will_set_u_free wrote:
I recently had a conversation with my love one, and I was telling her, how much I miss all the times we used to spent together and all the things we used to do, for sometime i felt that she still wanted to keep things the same way, but as time went on and as she realized that i was always rejecting coming to her church and accepting this father and mother thing, that's when she started falling apart from me.
I finally told her to tell me the truth and be honest with me, …. So she said that it's not that she doesn't wanna spent time with me or keep me away, it's just that i'm not at the same spiritual level she is (according to her) and that activities or people outside the church were just a distraction that kept her from following the truth and as long as she was in the truth things between me and her were never going to be the same.
I understood right and there how BRAINWASHED, she really is, and that's exactly why members of this group tend to steer away from family or friends who wont accept their newly acquired believes. for quite some time i was attending this place for studies just so i could have some quality time with her (IF YOU CAN CALL THAT QUALITY TIME) but i was growing upset by the pressure this group and my love one was always putting up in me by wanting me to get baptized.
I can totally relate to your story. Almost as if it was my own. The behavior and mentality is the same in most cases.
When a member who had been "firm in faith" would suddenly dissapear, I was always told some outlandish story, that they died, or went to Satan, or moved out of the country. They would never be spoken of again, like they never even existed. Huge red flag."
OMFG that is sooo true. I remember when I was a member, if another member fell away it was like they vanished and we were not allowed to speak about about them any more. It would be like a few weeks would go by and and I would just realize "hey, I havent seen brother so-n-so for a while…." and nobody would talk about it.
When a member is not seen here with firm faith they usally call the leader and tell her to tell members that they have gone to another zion.If the members get to know the member has left they will tell them that they have been disturbed by satan and mother said wait thay will return back.So the foolish members live with the hope that if mother said so it will happen, but at the same time they will spoil the members name making various stories saying she /he is like judas who betrayed father and mother and left,or you will hear stories like that member who left wanted position in zion they will tell members various allegations so that hate is filled in the members heart to belive that the person who left is satan.If any one talks good about the member who left the pastor will tell the leaders to spy on the member who is talking good and see that she doesnt pass any infomation whats going on in zion so that the member want create any legal problem for them ,because the WMSCOG knows the mess they are into here in India.They also tell members dont talk about the person who left and make him /her a idol, we need to belive that every thing was done through father and mother. At the same time they also build fear in members if you are in contact with the member who left you will loose your soul and you will bring pain to father and mother because they can see every thing, so the weak emotional members are scared and will ignore you on the street even if they see you or they live in fear what if other members see me taliking to the member who left i will be blamed for passing information about zion.They will also try to check phones to see if the missing members number is in your cell phone, they even openly accuse members who were friends of the former member saying she is passing all the information.Big brain wash of fear and guilt.
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