- Topic
A good friend of mine gave me a part of the current WMSCOG calender and boy what a PR piece of junk this thing is! I'm looking at the September 2014 section of it right now and the first thing at the top right of the page is a claim that they are celebrating 50 years as a church. Lie number one for those of us that know that the WMSCOG was established in 1988 after their claim that Ahn was going to resurect and didn't. Name change and complete rewrite of their doctrine thus the WMSCOG was born. Maybe they are using fuzzy math? Oh, I'll bet that they are using a different calender in which case maybe 26 years is like some kind of dog years and equals 50 years in theory. If that is the case then I will make a public appology for my error. The next thing on the page is a quote of Galatians 4:26 about Jerusalem being their mother. This lie is so easily seen through if people would only read the book of Galatians without twisting it to seem like something else. Hello, it even says it's a metephore right in the begining of the book! Moving on: There is a picture on the page of a bunch guys and a title underneith it stating "2013 International Bible Seminar: World-renowned scholars gather together to testify about god the mother, based on scientific evidence." Facinating claim which would be very exciting to anyone involved in this group. Personally I wanted to learn more about this "scientific evidence" and these people that got together, did this research, and found this proof. As I searched I couldn't find anything! That sucked! Under this picture is a set of pictures that I could only assume are the key note speakers at this seminar. The first picture is of Kim Joo-Cheol who of course runs the whole WMSCOG and can in no way be held as a world renowned scholar. Very knowledgeable about his own created doctrine for sure but that's it. The next one is Jorge Maza, Former Principal of Air Force Academy of Peru. Members of our forum have tried to contact this guy to see what his real views are but were unable. I would also like to know why he is the former principal. Next is a guy named Carlos Gutierrez, Professor of Sanches Carrion National University in Huacho, Peru. When this fella was contacted and asked about his interest in god the mother he hung up and has not been available for comment since. Kinda strange for someone who is supposed to have proof! When a Google search is done on this university you find that it is tiny. How are they able to afford to have a "World-renowned scholar" as a teacher on their staff? The next picture is of a guy named Elias Caicedo. His title according to this is Doctor and the Chief Director of Surveillance and Sanitary Control of Health Department in Esmeraldas, Equador. This guy send up red flags to me because I think I have seen him on a WMSCOG video recieving an award from a counselman in Georgia for some kind of clean up effort. No one has been able to contact this guy for his side of this. I think even the title under this picture means janitor and night watchman. We may never know the truth about this one. August Kruesi, Technical Principal for Aerospace, Aerojet Rocketdyne, USA is the next picture shown. As members of our forum tried to get in contact with this guy it seems that he doesn't exhist. No one at this company has ever heard of him. What kind of smoke and lights show is this? The next fella posted is Paul Wilcox, Country Director of Both Koreas, Northeast Asia Policy Division, US Pacific Command. So far this is the only real credible person that I have seen on this list. He was contacted, admits he believes in god the mother and that she is Zahng in South Korea. He would not comment further but did promise to call back at a more convienent time for him. It's been months and no call back has been received. His position does concern me as it should you. The last person listed is a lady named Destinee Chambers. She boast a PHD in Neuroscience, Prof. of Psychology, American International College, USA. This college is a private college and is similar to any community college you might find. Her degree fits in with the teaching methods of the WMSCOG so that makes sence. She has not taken the opportunity to comment on this which again for someone who has proof seem really strange. When asking others in her field about her and her work they do not view her as an expert in any field. Once again the WMSCOG makes it too easy to blow holes in their claims.
I have seen this calendar and it is a piece of Propaganda and really not much else. It is clearly a religious calendar, but yet they don't put any of their own religious "must attend" dates on it. Not feasts, and not even their own Passover is noted. Of course, they don't have Christmas, Thanksgiving, or Easter, either. Bizarre, really. And then they have Valentine's Day, Veteran's Day, Fourth of July, Columbus Day, Mother's Day, etc. Why put those on your religious calendar, and not anything else? I think it is made and then distributed to members so that when they look at certain pages it reinforces the mind control of the wms. Look at all the people on the September calendar who are so much smarter than you are, and they believe in Mother! You are so right to be part of our church!
I know that one of the people pictured on the September calendar page was contacted, and when asked about his "scientific proof, he said he didn't actually present scientific proof, but talked about nature. Well, we knew he didn't have proof, as was hyped on that page, but I wonder if he knew his picture and title were going to be used in the way they were? What was printed on that page was a gross misrepresentation in my opinion, meant to be used as propaganda to recruit and keep members. I mean, after all, if all these "reknowned scholars" have "scientific proof" then how can you with your little mind resist joining us? That is what the manipulation seems to be here.
@JoshuaI — remember my significant-other showed me a magazine once. It was full of successful people who happened to be members of WMS. People in aerospace, lawyers, flight attendants, etc. This was at the very beginning of her joining the WMS where I used to accuse her of being naive and not knowing what she was getting herself into. She told me "look at all these people, they all joined and they are very smart people." The idea behind the magazine is the same as the calendar you speak of. They want to show, especially their new members, that smart people join because they see the truth. Subliminally, they tell members to also be smart; another way to make them feel special, important, smart and unique.
@Joshua — Also note, that most people you mentioned who are on the calendar are Hispanics from Latin America, even though they might live in the States. Most of them are opportunist who fall and let themselves be part of these types of scams for profit. They sell their titles and Phd's for profit as well. We can even compare scams such as the pyramid groups who recruit people for memberships and to sell products. The situation is epidemic and no one highlights those issues in Latin America or the Carribean. It works exactly the same way with WMS in those countries.These people know that our population in Latin America is very ignorant and can very easily be taken advantage of.
@MM, maybe they don't publish their dates on the calendar so it won't be used against them in the near future when things don't happen according to their belief. They can just deny everything because there won't be any printed proof of it. Smart PR …!!!
@Travis: You could be right. They don't like to put things in writing because then it can be proven incorrect very easily. This calendar is a big mistake they made, in my opinion.
You do point out a pattern, though. They try to name drop and propagandize to have people believe that if they join the wms, they will be in the "intelligent" or "enlightened" crowd. It is very like a marketing technique called "social proofing" where you get people to believe that everybody who is anybody is doing it ("It" being whatever they are trying to get you to do or buy). It is a kind of social pressure technique. Again, the type of thing you can easily resist if you have been pre-warned. Exposure is they key.
I think that it is very easy to see past the wms if you are pre-warned. That is why, in many families, if one sibling is involved, no one else goes in, no matter what the pressure. The parents/siblings/ or other relatives let everyone know what has happened and what the wms is about, and no one else is susceptible to their manipulations. We all owe it to each other to get the word out.
Destinee Chambers is a member of the Connecticut Zion.
Yes, I figured that she was. I think I may have even seen her in a church video that was on youtube for a while.
^ good for you
Joshua wrote:
You know, every so often I just want to have a good knock down, drag out fight. …… Bring it on or stop pushing these lies!
Your frustration is understandable. But don't make the mistake of only viewing this organization as a "religion" with "theology" that can be doctrinally argued. It is a mind control cult masquerading as a religion, no different operationally speaking than Moonies, People's Temple, Manson, Scientology, etc etc.
If the cult victim comes to a "questioning" stage (through a wearing down process or some psychological awakening) there CAN be an opening to pursue logical argument that will help release the hold of the cult. But for those deeply trapped and not prepared to question internally, an argument is counterproductive and many times only reinforces the hold the cult has on the victim.
The website handling this forum does a great job in presenting plenty of evidence pointing out the fraud behind WMSCOG. However, for most of those caught in the cult, it takes a certain inner "breath of fresh air" to happen before they can even entertain the possibility of questioning the fraud that controls their mind. Most of us have to wait for that to happen to our loved one caught in the cult …. before really engaging in a theological or doctrinal argument.
@HH: I know that Joshua has a very good understanding of what the wms is. He has helped a lot of people to relaize what they are involved in. I think he has waited for that time when the members are open to discussion at times, and then also made some openings himself. He does very well when he talks to people. But, of course, you are right that some of us have to wait because our loved ones only go deeper with any discussion. So sad. That is the place I am. Five years and counting. Every time I think it can't get worse it does.
As I have said, the best antidote to the wms is prevention. All I can do right now is avoid the topic with my loved one and warn all others. Since I can't help him, I look for success in warning others. So far, I have 100% success rate on that. Not one person I have warned has been taken in by their manipulations. I also work on advising people who are in distress about how to handle the situation. I wish I had known what to do in the beginning.
With all the law suits against the wms I hope they will be held up to the light and examined soon.
Heinrich Hochhalter wrote:
… It is a mind control cult masquerading as a religion, no different operationally speaking than Moonies, People's Temple, Manson, Scientology, etc etc.
If the cult victim comes to a "questioning" stage (through a wearing down process or some psychological awakening) there CAN be an opening to pursue logical argument that will help release the hold of the cult. But for those deeply trapped and not prepared to question internally, an argument is counterproductive and many times only reinforces the hold the cult has on the victim…
Well said Heinrich
As painful as it maybe the only solution for those who have loved ones in the cult is to wait it out. Being patient, ever loving and supportive of the endevours of the minions no matter how ridiculous. This is a slow process but it's one that works, or rather on that one worked in my case.
My family's support was unconditional during my time in the cult and I only awoke after 7 years, the tipping point though was this website and the ncpog website as well. The videos by Ron and Diane also helped because I was rather curious why such staunch believers would have left and when they spoke of the harsh treatment they had received from the korean masters and the cultural clashes that they encountered it resonated so much with me. Realising the lies and the doctrinal fallacies only came later as my real objection at first was the korean culture which was extrodinarily painful to endure.
People without love will always be shown for what they are, that they are manipulative narcissistic and unforgiving and trample on a person's self worth and dignity and this is the point that has to be emphasised to win the victims back. Try not to argue about the so called "truth" taught by the cult, but rather focus on self-worth and on how the koreans treat them (this will especially work for those who are in the cult longer as the expectations and duties placed on these folks grow seeing how they are passed the love bombing stage). With time the victims will see the fake as/s conditional love of this cult for what it is.
Because the koreans have no respect for any other culture other than their own.
@HH.. thank you for the post though it maybe very late before i read it. i should have applied such idea beforehand to my family but due to excessive anger, my emotions drove me to immediately scold my wife and children for their being dumb fool to fall in the trap of this very destructive syndicate. Imagine, every time i had my vacations, just nobody mentions to me anything about all their activities. and me as also a dumb fool trusting all of them that nothing serious at hand. yet, I can blame my wife though blaming is just useless now. on my vacation times, i'm accompanying them to their worship and i observed nothing unusual, that i thought it's just another spring of a born-again christian. i was deceived by their start mass and end mass prayers invoking God the Father in the name of your son Jesus — typical of perhaps all christian denominations. Their pastors though have had not invited me to be baptized nor introduce something about their preachings. well, my wife might have given caution to the pastors not to open any subject about their faith due to a fact that even when i was still a christian, i worship no one except the GOD of Creation. I follow Jesus personal teachings and i adhere to the words written coming from his tonque and not on the basis of according to. i embraced Islam just 3 years ago despite working in a pure Muslim country since 1986.
Now i'm left alone, i lost money because i have to send them monthly remittance, i don't even see too any of the jewelries i bought with my hard earned money for my wife. the thing is even my own family applied to me lies and deception too, a technique that they learned for sure from this group. At times, my thinking goes how to put vengeance to this group, but i am hold by the Quran .. Leave it to ALLAH.
but i am hold by the Quran .. Leave it to ALLAH.
You can help Allah by maintaining some kind of bridge between you and your family, however possible that is. If you totally cut off communication you aid the cult. It is extremely hard but you must do it. From personal experience I have learned this lesson well. No matter what your faith, you cannot let your anger or frustration break your bond with your family or loved one. You are only aiding the cult of WMSCOG when you do ……
The wearing down process happens with almost all who are trapped in cults like this. Your loved ones will eventually find their way out, although it most likely will take a long time. Be there for them when they do, because they will need you.
@Heinrich Hochhalter – I entirely agree with your assessment.
Did you bump this for a reason dez?
If there is someone on this site who was pictured on this calendar under the heading that they presented scientific proof of the existence of Mother God, would you please come forward with that evidence, or tell us if you were misrepresented?
One of the persons pictured on that calendar under that heading has said outright when asked that he did not present scientific evidence of the existence of Mother God. Anyone else?
That’s so funny. That’s an aggressive hint-hint! I’ll post, but please try not to conflate what I say with what others are suggesting.
Good afternoon. It is I -in the flesh (joke, I suppose). To respond to your attack on the participants of the International Bible Seminar (represented on the calendar and everywhere else for that matter). I would first like to say that attacking the individual members in most cases is not fair. They are doing what they think is right.
Additionally, to set some things straight:
I do not boast about my academic achievement.Before I was persuaded to participate in the many videos, talks, etc.,I did not even mention my degree to friends and family. I preferred not to because it makes others feel uncomfortable and unfortunately sometimes intellectually inferior. It’s dumb,I know, but that is what happens, so I preferred to keep it a secret.
Next, my degree is legit. I earned it and the institution that I work for is a fine one. It is a 4 year institution, differing from community colleges on many levels. I have a full time tenure track position there, so if possible I’d appreciate if you would be so kind as to edit your post.
Next, I did not comment because I WAS UNAWARE OF ANY ATTEMPTS TO CONTACT ME! I would not have come and read this post as an active member because we were forbade (as you know). I did Google myself one day though- because I started to realize that my name was getting connected with the church on all sorts of media fronts and that made me uncomfortable.
Why? Because I’m an awesome, dedicated college professor but a world renowned scientist IS a bit of a stretch. That’s not my goal in life, I enjoy what I do.
I am an expert at what I do, but I’m curious who you would ask?
With all of that being said, scientific EVIDENCE? No. I was told that heavenly mother wanted me to come for a special mission to deliver a talk to show evidence of god the mother through my profession (Neuroscience). If you had faith, what would you do? I tried my best. Did I realize it would lead to videos, news articles, magazine articles, and pamphlets dished out all over the world? No. I suppose in this case, I am world renowned – in the church. Did I know it would lead to other requests (missions) to deliver a speech or to have my likeness and testimony presented on digital billboards (in locations still unknown to me)? Nope. Can I say these statements are true for all of the participants? Nope. Do I agree with everything posted on this site? Sorry, No. Am I thankful this site exists? Absolutely. I hope that the members of the organization will miraculously understand the need to clear my name and will also realize that I’m only explaining the true account.
As a last word, I was a faithful and active member/leader/teacher/member again of the church from 2011 and am no longer affiliated as of November 2015. I’m moving on and making ammends with my loved ones. ❤ I’m happy and free, except for when I think of the members who are afraid to open their eyes❤.
dezCPhD wrote:
Good afternoon. It is I -in the flesh (joke, I suppose). To respond to your attack on the participants of the International Bible Seminar (represented on the calendar and everywhere else for that matter). I would first like to say that attacking the individual members in most cases is not fair. They are doing what they think is right.
Additionally, to set some things straight:
I do not boast about my academic achievement.Before I was persuaded to participate in the many videos, talks, etc.,I did not even mention my degree to friends and family. I preferred not to because it makes others feel uncomfortable and unfortunately sometimes intellectually inferior. It's dumb,I know, but that is what happens, so I preferred to keep it a secret.
Next, my degree is legit. I earned it and the institution that I work for is a fine one. It is a 4 year institution, differing from community colleges on many levels. I have a full time tenure track position there, so if possible I'd appreciate if you would be so kind as to edit your post.
Next, I did not comment because I WAS UNAWARE OF ANY ATTEMPTS TO CONTACT ME! I would not have come and read this post as an active member because we were forbade (as you know). I did Google myself one day though- because I started to realize that my name was getting connected with the church on all sorts of media fronts and that made me uncomfortable.
Why? Because I'm an awesome, dedicated college professor but a world renowned scientist IS a bit of a stretch. That's not my goal in life, I enjoy what I do.
I am an expert at what I do, but I'm curious who you would ask?
With all of that being said, scientific EVIDENCE? No. I was told that heavenly mother wanted me to come for a special mission to deliver a talk to show evidence of god the mother through my profession (Neuroscience). If you had faith, what would you do? I tried my best. Did I realize it would lead to videos, news articles, magazine articles, and pamphlets dished out all over the world? No. I suppose in this case, I am world renowned – in the church. Did I know it would lead to other requests (missions) to deliver a speech or to have my likeness and testimony presented on digital billboards (in locations still unknown to me)? Nope. Can I say these statements are true for all of the participants? Nope. Do I agree with everything posted on this site? Sorry, No. Am I thankful this site exists? Absolutely. I hope that the members of the organization will miraculously understand the need to clear my name and will also realize that I'm only explaining the true account.
As a last word, I was a faithful and active member/leader/teacher/member again of the church from 2011 and am no longer affiliated as of November 2015. I'm moving on and making ammends with my loved ones. ❤ I'm happy and free, except for when I think of the members who are afraid to open their eyes❤.
I am glad you are happy and free, and welcome to the boards. I do hope you stay and post 🙂
In the church I attended, we watched many of your videos and you were very well known to us. In all honesty you were a coveted member/leader. I do have a question, it says that you were a chairman of Daejayon and the We Love you foundation non profits. What exactly is Daejayon?
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